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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

View Poll Results: Are you getting fed up with Brexit and should we go back to discussing other things ?
YES - Close the thread 21 47.73%
NO - Keep the debate going on for eternity 23 52.27%
Voters: 44. You may not vote on this poll

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  #2716  
Old 11th December 2018
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MJ224 MJ224 is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

The country is split (48:52) thus parliament is split too, but if they actually voted with their beliefs, I would suggest the Remainers there would win by quite a margin...….

We moan at them, but this challenge is spiked. The MP's are trying to accommodate the 48:52 split, but...…….

The system is .u...d ...……….
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  #2717  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdk42 View Post
Surely the response to this is to recognise that change is needed in the EU. Best to be in the tent helping to shape its future.
How many times has that been said, and how many times have they even listened.
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  #2718  
Old 11th December 2018
Internaut Internaut is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by wornish View Post
How many times has that been said, and how many times have they even listened.
Many times. Britain has won plenty of opt outs precisely because they did listen.
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  #2719  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

The knives will be out today, sharpened and readied. The SNP, Lib Dems, possibly the DUP, disenchanted tories will be ganging up, each with their goal, the target will be May. A coalition of hell.
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  #2720  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Here's a handy summary of where we are (or were yesterday) and what might happen next, from the New York Times so uncoloured by local opinion!
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...VzA_1VB7BCmj08
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  #2721  
Old 11th December 2018
Darkroom Darkroom is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gate Keeper View Post
The knives will be out today, sharpened and readied. The SNP, Lib Dems, possibly the DUP, disenchanted tories will be ganging up, each with their goal, the target will be May. A coalition of hell.
Don't worry too much Phil. Just go off and enjoy your African safari. The UK will still be here when you make another fleeting visit next year

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  #2722  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tram View Post
Democracy means you can change your mind
Oh really ? Only by your vote at the next General Election.

Jax
  #2723  
Old 11th December 2018
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

In the spirit of respecting democracy, should the talked about referendum, aka the 'people's vote', be the best out of three?
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  #2724  
Old 11th December 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by wornish View Post
How many times has that been said, and how many times have they even listened.
Why would they listen to us in this instance? We, having decided to consider whether we wanted to stay in, and that a referendum was a good idea, and then voting to leave, would be telling them that they should not go down that path. Lead balloon (or Titanic) time!

Harold
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  #2725  
Old 11th December 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gate Keeper View Post
The knives will be out today, sharpened and readied. The SNP, Lib Dems, possibly the DUP, disenchanted tories will be ganging up, each with their goal, the target will be May. A coalition of hell.
Never cast a clout till May is out.

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  #2726  
Old 11th December 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tram View Post
Maybe the supreme court should rule on this matter, more chance of getting a result based on fact.
Judges can decide which evidence is inadmissible.

Harold
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  #2727  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
In the spirit of respecting democracy, should the talked about referendum, aka the 'people's vote', be the best out of three?
Why restrict democracy to a mere 3 ?

Jax
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  #2728  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harold Gough View Post
Judges can decide which evidence is inadmissible.

Harold
Which, in the case in question, would no doubt mean a collapse, due to lack of admissible evidence.

Jax
  #2729  
Old 11th December 2018
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Government's Brexit economic analysis was inadequate, says Commons Treasury committee
It gets worse and worse:

https://www.parliament.uk/documents/...pean-Union.pdf

Extract:
Quote:
After an extensive exchange of letters and with discussion at various oral evidence
sessions, the Committee expresses its disappointment that the Treasury did not
provide all evidence that the Committee requested. The Treasury did not produce
short-term analysis of any scenarios. The Committee is also disappointed that the
Treasury modelled scenarios that have been rejected by the EU (i.e. Chequers) yet
did not model scenarios that are considered probable and have the potential to be
persistent over the medium to long term (i.e. the Backstop). And while the Office for
Budget Responsibility now undertakes this sort of short-term analysis for the Budget
and other fiscal events, the OBR can only forecast based on stated Government policy;
the political declaration is only a statement of intent. Therefore, there is no short-term
analysis of the deal upon which Parliament will vote.
Quote:
The committee is disappointed that the government has modelled its white paper, which represents the most optimistic reading of the political declaration, rather than a more realistic scenario.
It's amazing the lengths to which the government has been prepared to go to keep MPs and the public in the dark. It really is time for them to move on.
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  #2730  
Old 11th December 2018
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
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Re: Political: We're doomed, Captain Mannering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ224 View Post
The country is split (48:52) thus parliament is split too, but if they actually voted with their beliefs, I would suggest the Remainers there would win by quite a margin....

We moan at them, but this challenge is spiked. The MP's are trying to accommodate the 48:52 split, but....

The system is .u...d ....
For something so monumental does the the system of 'first past the post' offer sufficient margin?! (thats an interrobang); I think not. It works during elections because the electorate can reverse their decision every five years. In the case of an in/out referendum it is almost permanent. What the margin should be I have no idea, but statistics may be our friend.
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