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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

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Old 8th January 2015
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QHD screens

For photo editing, is more pixels better?

I'd leave it there with the word discuss underneath but I have to put in some more, I apologise in advance for the rambled musing!

<MUSE, RANT>

I have been looking at new laptops. First and foremost it must be a laptop and function as such - its my primary (only) machine and I have a tablet and a smart phone. Secondly it must be graphics capable.

Enter the MacBook Pro Retina. Here is my backstop for both cost and performance. Its what I'm prepared to go and splash on. Then I delve a little deeper and see what else is available just for my own satisfaction and to complete my suitable research before the purchase of anything. Samsung Ativ book 9 plus, Acer S7 and Lenovo Yoga 2 Pro are the stand outs with blistering performance and QHD screens (3200x1800 pixels) to boot.

Book 9 + is out as Samsung have discontinued it and the new "Book 9" doesn't have the QHD screen hence no longer justifying over a Mac.

Acer S7 is out as they cost serious wedge, much more than I'm willing to pay though they are truly brilliant machines and featherweight.

Lenovo Yoga 2 pro - better spec than the appropriate MBP - base model is an i7 processor, 8gb ram, lighter, thinner and that wonderful 3200x1800 touchscreen.

I took the plunge with one on sale for £250 less than the Mac (thank you John Lewis sale email!) I was looking at. Windows 8.1 works well, the whole transforming thing of the Yoga also works well. The hardware is simply beatiful, the screen incredible too. Having a touch screen and a keyboard is the most intuitive thing in the world to me. Also a cold boot into Windows in under 4 seconds is impressive - many computers don't even resume that quickly.

Great I think (aside from the windows prejudices that I have on "your trial version of XYZ expires in 30 days, cough up £x"), install GIMP. Problem. Whilst the Windows controlled bits have scaled, brushes etc in the toolboxes have not and are too small to use. Fine, issue but not the end of the world. Install trial version of Lightroom, the whole downloading interface is tiny (not scaled by Windows...) the programme itself once getting out the magnifying glass to select my choice(!) slightly better but still small.

I could reduce the resolution in desktop mode of windows but that defeats my big resolution desires. Not good.

Now I have delved a bit deeper, out of my 128gb SSD, Windows sees 120gb, the rest it recovery partition. I'm happy with this 8gb loss. Now on the Windows drive I have 120gb, of which there is 64gb free space! Bare in mind this is out of the box, nothing changed around, some bloatware. Of that useage here is a big breakdown (rounded)
  • Windows folder 16gb
  • Windows.old folder 4gb
  • Drivers folder 3gb
So there is a good start. OSX is around 10gb(ish) all in.


This is no fault of hardware, its amazing. Its no fault of Microsoft in building Windows 8.1 - I actually get along very well with it coming from an XP/7 environment at work and Ubuntu at home - except its a little on the fat side. It is however the issue of developers who haven't kept up with the increase in resolution in modern devices and scaled their applications appropriately.

Unfortunately (for the Yoga and Lenovo because I genuinely think its brilliant, but not that I'm having to chop it in for a Mac) I think its going back and I'll be going to my stalwart of Macbook Pro retina. I'd be very torn if I did just want a laptop/transformer with the functionality and at the price.

The only thing that remains is whether to wait and see what the new MBP can offer or just get out and buy one... Cavaet Emptor on big resolution laptops and tech purchases ladies and gents.

</MUSE,RANT>
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

I'm a little unsure on what more pixels on screen would give you for editing. Sure, you'd see an image clearer. But only you. It wouldn't affect the output. Or would it?
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Its for me the (thought of) editing - being able to see a larger area whilst cloning for example at a certain zoom level or being able to view side by side comparisons more easily at a glance for compare/contrast.

End product probably has no difference.
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Quote:
Originally Posted by al_kaholik View Post
Its for me the (thought of) editing - being able to see a larger area whilst cloning for example at a certain zoom level or being able to view side by side comparisons more easily at a glance for compare/contrast.

End product probably has no difference.
Yes, I see what you mean in context with physical screen size. I'm spoiled by my iMac's 27" screen, even if it isn't Retina.
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

First and foremost I believe the screen should have as wide a colour gamut as possible, be capable of calibration and be stable.
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

If it's lots of pixels you want there is now an iMac 27" Retina -5120 x 2880 to be precise.
Lots of dosh (£2K for the base model, £2.5K if you upgrade it to i7 CPUs & faster graphics)!

It sounds delightful for running Lightroom, but I wonder how big/small any Windows stuff would appear if you were running BootCamp?
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Colour seems good - some early issues that have been fixed to a standard I'd be happy with.

For me, it needs to be portable, I'm happy to go grab another screen for use at home, but its on the go I want. Many pixels on a small screen seemed a good idea. It was a good idea, just not so great in execution. A few more days playing but I'm pretty convinced its days are numbered.
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Come back in two years....

No??

We're once again in an era where hardware "advances" are driving software, sadly, and it's still and yet more pixels with everything. Personally I'd rather technology improvements focused on quality rather than quantity.

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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

I looked at Yoga laptops and the Y50-70 and a 95% Gamaut custom built laptop from PC specialist.... then I looked at my bank balance and settled for and average HP from PC world (and their shocking custoner service).

The screen is OK - but then I'm no conoiser or expert on such things. Saving up for the custom built 95% Gamaut screen laptop
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

You could try Magnifier V2.4 from Iconico.
Unlike the standard magnification offerings which place the magnified view under the cursor this is a separate window which shows a magnified view of what is under the cursor. So in the scenario of small icons in a tool bar place the magnification window above (or to the side) of your editing window with your toolbar wide and short (or tall and thin) and then you can scroll the mouse happilly over the editing windows without any annoying popup and look at the magnified view when you are over the toolbar. Hint - turn the hi-lite (sic) feature on to put a little sqaure in the magnified view to show where the mouse pointer is. Its also great for accurate cursor placement when selecting an area.
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Re: QHD screens

In every day use (such as typing this) and general working, its brilliant. OK I had to settle and not get the bright orange one, that was my preference, but they didn't have them on sale. The keyboard is fantastic to type on and look at (black and backlit), the screen is something to marvel at in every day use. Its pitfall is just some of the applications. I'd say quality and quantity here, just some things don't work.

I called John Lewis today, they advised me to "have a longer trial with the product", 90 days in fact which is there standard return to base no quibble policy. I'm chuffed to say the least. More time trying this out at which point the new MBP may come out or I might find favour in it.

OM USer, I like the thinking, I'm trying to stay away from hacks if possible but will keep it in mind.
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Old 8th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

I just obtained a very high spec windows laptop, purely to do one function I could nt do because of the software protection. I now remember why I went away from PCs 9 years ago, even with a brand new machine I found just getting windows updates I had 51 different viruses on the computer. I wouldn't mind except I had only gone the MS site before installing a paid version of Anti-virus software which is duel on my Mac.

I have tested the new 15" MBP which I have tried to get to crash with some serious programs open & never succeeded 10/10.

If you are talking about pixels then the 5K iMac my wife bought me for my 60th birthday & Christmas is the bees knees. I really can appreciate what you are saying as I now edit almost at 100% without pressing the view keys, makes editing & seeing details so much better & Adobe & LR in the CC versions support the 5K retina screen.
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Old 9th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Lot of love for the Macs, I'm going to see what I get on with and how useable it is. Its everything that isn't on the Mac hardware wise which make it nice, but I too remember why I'd moved away from Windows for home computing. The bundling, antivirus, "trial" programmes. All frustrating when you put what most people, including myself, consider a reasonable sum on something.
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Old 9th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

I very rarely buy the latest and greatest product, I prefer to get a new pre aged product ie the end of the line, the price is reduced and the bugs are known.
The best MBP are from early 2012 or late 2011, they are the last ones that you can increase the memory to 16GB of ram and upgrade the disc drive, I have added a 1TB SSD and maxed out the memory. I also bought it about £900 of list price and it included a 3 year warranty from the time I bought it.

For main home use look at the last big box Mac Pros - there are lots on eBay, you can add extra eSata ports, USB 3 ports and include 4 hard drives or SSDs, plus any you attach via the additional eSata ports.

You can update the Video card to support a big screen (if one is not included)

When I bought my last MBP I did a wants and needs list and the Retina screen was displaced by upgradability.

My next task is to replace my early 2008 Mac Pro with the latest big box Mac Pro (not the trash can) that I can get for a reasonable price. It will give more upgrade potential.
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Old 9th January 2015
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Re: QHD screens

Returning to the OP's question, I bought a 27 inch Iiyama monitor for my desktop PC. (This has a glass front, and I believe is the same panel used in the 27" Mac.)

The monitor has a resolution of 2560 x 1440 which is brilliant for photo editing, but as you have found, some menu text is just far too small to read. There are ways in which the text size can be increased through Windows, but all too often this results in unwanted effects such as distorted icons.

I get around the problem by changing the screen resolution when I need to read text (such as when doing accounts), but given the popularity of ultra high resolution monitors it is about time that Microsoft did something to scale menu text appropriately.

Unfortunately there are too many apps that I use that are simply not supported by the Mac platform.
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