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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

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  #31  
Old 5th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

These sort of un announced changes would definitely annoy me too. Looks like another plus for Apple.
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  #32  
Old 5th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

At least Apple did announce that 32-bit apps would no longer run under the latest version of iOS, but that doesn't allay the fact that they don't, and won't unless their developers update them. I have several that have not been updated and it looks unlikely that they ever will be. This is just as annoying, if not more so! At least (most) 32-bit software still runs under 64-bit Windows.



Meanwhile Linux (and other free software) continues to be updated and its user base expanded. It's a lot less user-friendly than either Windows or MacOS but it is at least a viable alternative.
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  #33  
Old 5th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

Take a look at the link below and then decide whether W10 updates are the result of user error.


https://www.askwoody.com/


Take the time to read back a good few posts. IME W10 updates are an unmitigated disaster.
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  #34  
Old 5th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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At least Apple did announce that 32-bit apps would no longer run under the latest version of iOS, but that doesn't allay the fact that they don't, and won't unless their developers update them. I have several that have not been updated and it looks unlikely that they ever will be. This is just as annoying, if not more so! At least (most) 32-bit software still runs under 64-bit Windows.



Meanwhile Linux (and other free software) continues to be updated and its user base expanded. It's a lot less user-friendly than either Windows or MacOS but it is at least a viable alternative.
There is one thing that you didn't say Richard: if you have a Mac running say El Capitan (10.11) you aren't forced to upgrade to Sierra or High Sierra. I'm still running Yosemite. I was offered High Sierra (and the other two) but haven't bothered; why should I, when Yosemite is fine? However, when support for Yosemite ceases (a while yet) I might think again; but at that point, I could think about a new computer anyway, so it wouldn't matter. Software only lasts so long.
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

I know very little about MacOS Keith having never used a Mac. That is a fair point, although MS didn't force people to upgrade from Windows 7. I don't know whether 10 was forced on users of 8 or 8.1 as I never used either. I was on the point of going back to 7 when I first installed 10 as it was a mess, but for the most part I'm happy with it now. Given Windows' history and the vast variety of hardware running it I guess we can be grateful that it still supports a lot of old hardware. I hope that if Win10 is the last ever version that they never change the requirements for hardware drivers - having to change drivers was the main aggro when the version was changed - I needed to buy a new graphics card as AMD didn't write a Win10 driver for the old one.
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  #36  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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Originally Posted by Phill D View Post
OK as someone who needs to get a new PC fairly soon and who is currently on Win 7 dare I ask what is wrong with Win10?
I'm likely to stay with Microsoft but there is a large faction in my local camera club who say I really should switch to apple? just not sure I want to add all that extra hassle to the learning curve.
Not sure why your camera club members are steering you that way but here is my two penny worth. Windows and Apple operating systems are two ways of achieving the same objective, I guess that Photoshop runs pretty much the same on both. I changed from my 7 year old Windows laptop + external calibrated monitor 18 months ago to an iMac 27" display. Like you, I was very apprehensive before about making the change having used Windows from version 3.0

Aided and abetted by my then 9 year-old grandson, I took the plunge and have not regretted the move - that by the way does not make me an Apple acolyte.
if you make the change, just make sure that the spec is the best for you can afford. I don't care about tinkering with machines, just like my car I just want it to work without getting under the bonnet..

The Mac OS is quite intuitive and I'm still learning but definitely not stressed. Factor in buying new versions of existing software, I bought a genealogical programme, Office for Apple and Affinity Photo (about 45) for post production. I'm very happy with the latter it is a powerful package and do not miss Photoshop at all. The Apple community is good for resolving issues.

The transfer of data is covered by an Apple utility. I bought a partitionable 2GB external drive (needed in any event). I copied the Windows laptop data to the Windows partition on the HD, then copied from the Windows partition to the Apple partition. From there, I copied the data to the iMac. I am deeply impractical but if I can do it............

I would say that using a 27" Retina screen has greatly improved my ability to get the final image the way I want it.

Finally, it's is probably best to ignore the blather and bias that surrounds this subject. Apple products are expensive but the cost of ownership is spread over a long period and possibly you can sell it when you want/need a change.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

David
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  #37  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

Well I'm a Win10 fan. it upgraded smoothly and has done so with every update and it just works... for me.

We have some really old apps (20 year old ,16 bit, written for win95 ) still running at work - no win 10 issue here just corporate inertia to replace a system that works and is cheap to run (no support = no support costs [don't get me started!])

Re the debate MS vs Apple - as already said they both do a job and once you are familiar with each they should do as required

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  #38  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

Finally it seems that Microsoft has been listening.

Can scarcely believe that suddenly my main gripe has disappeared; two webpages can now be opened side by side on the home screen, unless the change is due to having installed Firefox as my default browser (replacing IE). Glory be!
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  #39  
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

Probably down to Firefox which has been my browser of choice for many years. Anyway, problem solved, that's the main thing!
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  #40  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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I know very little about MacOS Keith having never used a Mac. That is a fair point, although MS didn't force people to upgrade from Windows 7. I don't know whether 10 was forced on users of 8 or 8.1 as I never used either. I was on the point of going back to 7 when I first installed 10 as it was a mess, but for the most part I'm happy with it now. Given Windows' history and the vast variety of hardware running it I guess we can be grateful that it still supports a lot of old hardware. I hope that if Win10 is the last ever version that they never change the requirements for hardware drivers - having to change drivers was the main aggro when the version was changed - I needed to buy a new graphics card as AMD didn't write a Win10 driver for the old one.
The big, fundamental difference between Windows and Mac is that Windows is an open system; that could be why some machines work well with 10, and others are a nightmare. Macs aren't an open system, they are factory built, everything is basically down to Apple. That makes changes and updates smoother and more reliable, since they know how everything will react. In about 4 years I've had one or two very small issues, but nothing of account; with Win 7, towards the end, it was so bad that I got close to throwing the b--- thing through the window!
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  #41  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

I know what you mean, I had a lot of issues with my little Lenovo Q180 box that's about the size of a Mac Mini, with everything integrated on the motherboard. When Win10 came along the graphics wouldn't work properly and the built-in Photos and Videos apps just crashed into a BSoD. No updated driver available, and I couldn't change the graphics card because it's part of the CPU chip! The hard drive was at 100% for up an hour each time it booted up making the thing hopelessly slow. I was on the point of reverting to the Win7 it came with, and even considered Linux, but now having binned the offending apps and following a year or two of 10 updates it runs relatively smoothly again.


Years ago when Apple launched the original little white Mac, our computer dealer at work enthusiastically left us one to play with to see if we liked it. It sat on the desk with a little green cursor blinking, and we were unable to get it to do anything whatsoever. We stuck with Windows which was then at v2.0 but at least we could use it . I can see the advantages of Apple's closed system in some ways but I think the lack of flexibility and expandability is limiting in an engineering environment.
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  #42  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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Well, you have been previously using a 12 year old version of IE7 . Almost as bad as my wife still using MS Word 97

John

LOL .. I was thinking much the same. I couldn't remember how long ago it was that was implemented

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  #43  
Old 6th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

Have not read all comments here, but am with Shenstone. Windows 10 has worked well for me. Also liked 8.1 and 7....Must be easy to please.

Have to say I really liked DOS 6, but can see the advantages of the present system.

Never tried Apple Mac, but despite liking their phones, I would be very hesitant to dip my toe in that pond....

Windows is so prolific, its strength and perhaps weakness......
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  #44  
Old 10th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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Well, you have been previously using a 12 year old version of IE7 . Almost as bad as my wife still using MS Word 97 John
If I could swap Win10 for that 12yr old IE7 and MS Word 97 I would do so in a heartbeat. Of course the new versions can perform the same functions with extra bells and whistles in a more convoluted way. Our devices were surely invented to make life easier, but I'd argue that in most cases they don't.
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  #45  
Old 11th August 2018
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Re: The Windows10 Disaster

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Originally Posted by pandora View Post
If I could swap Win10 for that 12yr old IE7 and MS Word 97 I would do so in a heartbeat. Of course the new versions can perform the same functions with extra bells and whistles in a more convoluted way. Our devices were surely invented to make life easier, but I'd argue that in most cases they don't.
When I was at work we used Win 97 for a long time after its sell-by date. I have never come across any version of Word 97 that could create so many "undocumented features"! One ten page document that I produced suddenly expanded to over 5000 pages. Yes - you read that right - 5000! And I couldn't get rid of all the unwanted pages!

Then there was another document that suddenly decided that it wouldn't let me into one page that i had written. I could place the cursor on the last letter of the page before, press the right arrow, and...it jumped to the first letter of the next but one page! I had to cut and paste all the pages before the inaccessible one, and put them into a new blank document, then do the same with all the pages after the inaccessible one. Then it decided it would;t let me into a different page! I ended up having to rewrite the whole document from scratch.

Then there was an AutoCAD drawing that I needed to modify. I could change a dimension, and all was well. Change another dimension, and the whole drawing reconfigured itself! Holes moved, text moved or disappeared. I got so furious with it, I left work early, before I threw my computer out of the office window (which would have got me fired, no doubt!) My boss got all of us who knew AutoCAD together, and we tried to sort it collectively. After about two hours we gave up, and I had to redraw the whole damned lot.

Oh what singularly happy days.......
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