Olympus UK E-System User Group
Olympus UK E-System User Group

Join our unique resource for Olympus Four Thirds E-System DSLR and Pen and OM-D Micro Four Thirds photographers. Show your images via our free e-group photo gallery. Please read the e-group.uk.net forum terms and conditions before posting for the first time. Above all, welcome!


Go Back   Olympus UK E-System User Group > Cameras, lenses and system accessories > Camera conference > Olympus E-500

Olympus E-500 E-500 specific discussion.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 31st May 2008
dennisg
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Question Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

I am finally after a year and half diving into the RAW file world. In the past several weeks I have purchased two software packages that I will be using for my RAW files. The first is Picture Window Pro 4.0 and Archsoft PhotoStudio Darkroom 1.5. I intend to use the later one to fimiliarize myself with editing the RAW files that I will be capturing this summer. Then move on to the other for a more advanced editing.

In the past several weeks I have been reading some great Photo Magazines from the UK; Digital SLR Photograpy and Digital Camera World. Both are a great source of information and they both are much better then some of the photo magaizines published here on this side of the pond!

Thus here is my dilema. As I read, using the histogram to monitor the Dynamic Range in a RAW file is not an accurate source to judge the quality of the shot taken. Then they say you need to get the optimim result when shooting RAW! So, if the histogram is not accurate, and you need to get a optimized shot, how do I measure the "Optimum" result using the E500 in the field. I would like very much to get the best possible shot right from the get-go so that editing can be less tiresome and can bring out the most information the the RAW file has to offer!

Believe me I understand the difference between a JPEG and RAW file, but I want to be able to obtain the results expected utilizing the RAW format.

Last, how does one reduce the "Blow-Out" that the E500 exhibits when the lighting scenario has a wide dynamic range? I really need to find a way to get a better result here.

Thanks to all who will put in their own two cents in these questions asked! I am going to purchase an E520 body this fall and I understand that this upgrade does a much better job with RAW files and dynamic range within a file.

Dennis G
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 31st May 2008
snaarman's Avatar
snaarman snaarman is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Baaarkshire UK
Posts: 6,838
Thanks: 494
Thanked 417 Times in 325 Posts
Likes: 492
Liked 1,291 Times in 498 Posts
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

I'm not so certain about that advice to optimise for RAW..

I use an E-400 which is a CCD imager, and I think there are some subtle differences in the way that CCD and CMOS imagers top out the highlights, but here goes..

Here is an experiment I did this morning. This is a typical impossible shot, with too much dynamic range for the camera.

Before I switched to RAW mode last year I always set my cameras to -0.3 stop compensation in the hope that it would preserve the highlights. The theory is you may lose the shadows but that looks more acceptable that blowing the highlights.

These days I don't usually use exposure compensation, but shoot RAW + Jpeg. If I check the histogram of the shot then I might see it has hit the upper end but I don't worry too much. I have found the ACR plugin can recover a couple of stops of over-exposure, (but you need to check the recovered colours very carefully).

In this example (left side = RAW) I used something like -1.5 stops of recovery , then adjusted "fill light" to lift the shadows up from black. The right side (Jpeg) had a lot of gamma adjustment to bring it down from clipped highlights.

To my mind, the mangled jpeg has an artificial look, and the resultant blacked out shadows can't be recovered, whereas the recovered RAW looks more natural.

I might point out that neither shot is a keeper!






Pete
__________________
Look, I'm an old man. I shouldn't be expected to put up with this.


Pete's photoblog Misleading the public since 2010.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 31st May 2008
Crouchy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

There is a very good article on the Photopro web site by Andrew Rodney on shooting Raw. Also on the Luminous Landscape web site about exposing to the right (on your histogram). One main problem is the histogram shows the JPEG not the raw. But generally it is best not to underexpose as this results in noise in the shadows. Look at www.digitalphotopro.com.
Cheers
Andy.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 31st May 2008
Graham_of_Rainham's Avatar
Graham_of_Rainham Graham_of_Rainham is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Rainham
Posts: 8,131
Thanks: 644
Thanked 940 Times in 728 Posts
Likes: 2,276
Liked 1,581 Times in 911 Posts
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

Hi,
I have to agree with Pete. I have my E-500 set at -0.7 most of the time and always use RAW. Recovering detail from shadows is much better than from burnt out Hi-Lights.

One tip from the "Old School" is to have a mid grey card handy and expose from a full frame or spot reading off the card. While digital is fantastic, there are some very basic photographic techniques that have served us well for many years and are as valid today as they ever were.

Hope this helps

Graham

PS Well done Pete, one of the best examples and explanations I've seen.
__________________
Graham

We often repeat the mistakes we most enjoy...

Last edited by Graham_of_Rainham; 31st May 2008 at 09:43 AM. Reason: PS added
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 31st May 2008
dennisg
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Wink Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

To all, thanks for the insights and solutions on this subject.

Now I have also read that you can use ND filters to tame the blowout on the dynamic range. This way the filter does the reduction of light hitting the sensor instaed of using a compensation value. I would think that there would be less noise at the shadow side of the range due to the filter is being the gate keeper for keeping extreme lighting from hitting the sensor.

Is this correct thinking?

Thanks again for your inputs!

Dennis G:
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 31st May 2008
Nick Temple-Fry's Avatar
Nick Temple-Fry Nick Temple-Fry is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Wiltshire
Posts: 4,395
Thanks: 17
Thanked 190 Times in 142 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

Quote:
Originally Posted by dennisg View Post
To all, thanks for the insights and solutions on this subject.

Now I have also read that you can use ND filters to tame the blowout on the dynamic range. This way the filter does the reduction of light hitting the sensor instaed of using a compensation value. I would think that there would be less noise at the shadow side of the range due to the filter is being the gate keeper for keeping extreme lighting from hitting the sensor.

Is this correct thinking?

Thanks again for your inputs!

Dennis G:
Ho - hum - well yes and then again no.

The ND filter will reduce the light and therefore (if all other settings on the camera remain the same) help to tame burnout.

But your camera will, if left to its own devices, determine that the image is a bit darker than optimum, so it will lengthen your exposure and attempt to negate the effect of the filter.

Now what will exactly happen depends on how you are using your camera, so it's all a bit suck-it and see.

Nick
__________________
Nick Temple-Fry

Medicine as a science ranks somewhere between archaeology and economics.

www.theChurchPhotographer.co.uk 90 Churches -- Fairford St Mary's, exceptionally splendid
www.temple-fry.co.uk
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 31st May 2008
dennisg
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Wink Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

Now that's fast service! Thanks!

I kind of thought that the meter within the camera will do other things to get around the NS filter. So I will try to stop down .3 of an f stop and go from there. With everything stated on the forum, you need to get acquainted with the way your camera performs and then you will have abetter understanding on how top compensate to get the maximum return on the shots taken.

Tomorrow I will be shooting a Western Equestrain event here. It will be a dry and sunny spring day so I will report back on how this all worked out.

Thanks!

Dennis G
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 1st June 2008
photonutter's Avatar
photonutter photonutter is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: St Helens Merseyside
Posts: 270
Thanks: 15
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

One thing springs to mind, which histogram were they talking about? Unlike most other companies cameras' that use a histogram from either red or green chanel you get the whole hit from the E500 with all channels.
There is also personal preference and preconception for what your shooting. Things also to consider is the position and impact of any blown high lights, could they add to the composition? Do you shoot hi key shots where it's the norm?
If you use the nd filters or polarizers, both can dramatically increase detail in the shadows due to the longer exposure with higher saturation. You'll have to be careful with a polarizer though, can increase or decrease the dynamics in a shot depending on positioning and whats in the frame.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 1st June 2008
maccabeej maccabeej is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Orpington
Posts: 833
Thanks: 101
Thanked 111 Times in 95 Posts
Likes: 3
Liked 142 Times in 89 Posts
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500

This is just a minor point but can be important, a blown out white can exist eg specular highlights. Even that great master Ansel Adams recognised it in the Zone system. His methodology for large format negatives is very valid today using levels and curves in post processing where he adjusted development times.
The important thing about looking at a histogram is to know what to expect from the scene in front of you. By just aiming for maximum information ie no or minimal highlight and shadow clipping you may miss the optimum exposure for the most important part of the subject. Sorry if I have not expressed this well.

Jim
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 6th June 2008
dennisg
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Obtaining a good RAW file when taken-E500



To All,

I have gone to an equestrian event this apst weekend and shot fifty some odd pictures of the competitions there. I set the camer's exposure to a mius 1/3 f stop and used my 40-150 mm lens on my E500. The sun was going in and out due to a lot of cumulaus clouds on a sunny day. In addition to the f-stop adjustment, I used the histogram as a tool to monitor the dynamic range and exposure.

I am happy to announce that 85% of the shots came out swell. I use Archsoft's PhotoStudio Darrkroom 1.5 and used various tools including the curve tool. All of the printouts, 8x10s and one 12x18 were all winners.

So from now on I will be shooting the RAW format for my important work and JPEGS for other lesser important work. Now I can take all the pictures I need to publish my book, "The Equestrain Sport on Long Island". I will be using MPIX and their service to publish this book. If you are interested, go to www.mpix.com.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Norfolk UK (Huge File) Barr1e The lounge 0 13th May 2008 05:04 PM
ISO 50 for E500 photonutter Olympus E-500 7 28th April 2008 10:47 AM
Picture file sizes Ellie Camera conference 7 11th February 2008 08:22 PM
E500 for sale Yorkie The lounge 0 18th January 2008 08:29 PM
E3 raw file size - confused Invicta Olympus E-3 5 9th December 2007 02:11 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:36 AM.


The Write Technology Ltd, 2007-2019, All rights reservedAd Management plugin by RedTyger