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Olympus OM-D E-M1 The first Micro Four Thirds camera that offers phase detect focusing so you can use Four Thirds DSLR lenses normally as well a Micro Four Thirds lenses.

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Old 11th October 2013
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

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Originally Posted by brian1208 View Post
I've washed me "Thermals", dug out my water-proof trousers, sealskin water-proof gloves and "beanie hat", got the Soup Thermos ready.

Its a good chance to test the waterproof qualities of the EM-1 + 12-50 kit lens + panny 35-100. (I've stuck my EM-5 body in my bag just in case )
Brian, I had thermals on yesterday on Hayling Beach it was flippin freezin in the wind - and with two very thick Musto Fleeces on top ... wrapped for anything ... I must say rain was not part of the bargain ... Nick bought me a Mckellen ? spelling Rain Cape - SUPERB thing for me + kit + kitbag and I do have a clear waterproof 'thingie' for the camera

I have to ask, how do you compare the 75-300 to this panny 35-100 ?

I am wondering if I should have KEPT my 50-200 SWD lens although, it would have been HUGE on the ONE !
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Old 11th October 2013
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Duplicate post.

Last edited by DavyG; 11th October 2013 at 03:51 PM. Reason: Duplicate post
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Old 11th October 2013
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Chevvy, for me 35-100 is faster focusing, sharper, wider aperture so better in poor light and all together better IQ, except its 200mm shorter than the 75-300

I shall probably get either the 40-150 f2.8 or the panny 150 prime f2.8 when they come out and would love to see either an 80-200 f4 or better yet a 300 f4 (I think these lengths in f2.8 would be just too heavy and expensive)

As an aside and for what its worth, I think that the .jpg files 75-300 at 200mm are sharper and cleaner than the .jpgs from the 35-200 + 2X digital extender at 200mm
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

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Originally Posted by DavyG View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevvyf1
I seem to have used "Pattern" metering I was playing about rather a lot with settings ... and enlarging the "Green focus rectangle"
Hi Chevvy,

I've been reading this thread and I'm puzzled by what you mean by enlarging the Green Focus rectangle.

If I press the fn1 button then the info button I get the option of having a small focus rectangle, a standard focus rectangle, a block of nine focus rectangles or all of the focus triangles, is this what you mean?

If not, could you tell me how to enlarge the green focus rectangle on my E-M1?

Thanks,

Dave

Hi Dave, p.54 manual
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  #50  
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by brian1208 View Post
Chevvy, for me 35-100 is faster focusing, sharper, wider aperture so better in poor light and all together better IQ, except its 200mm shorter than the 75-300

I shall probably get either the 40-150 f2.8 or the panny 150 prime f2.8 when they come out and would love to see either an 80-200 f4 or better yet a 300 f4 (I think these lengths in f2.8 would be just too heavy and expensive)

As an aside and for what its worth, I think that the .jpg files 75-300 at 200mm are sharper and cleaner than the .jpgs from the 35-200 + 2X digital extender at 200mm

NY friends said " ... there is a strong belief aka 'rumour' ... a 300 m.34 is on the schedule (price pro rata to the 12-40 Pro lens due in November ) + some $ so maybe $2,500/$2,900


Interesting ~VERY Interesting ~ what you say about jpegs from 75-300
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

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Originally Posted by Chevvyf1 View Post
Hi Dave, p.54 manual
Thanks Chevvy,

I didn't realise you were talking about zoom frame AF, thanks for clarifying this.

Dave
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

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Originally Posted by DavyG View Post
Thanks Chevvy,

I didn't realise you were talking about zoom frame AF, thanks for clarifying this.

Dave
I hope you dont think me rude quoting p. No. but save writing the manual ! I have not yet learned "off heart" function names ... its all stuff from my first post re my telecon with Matt @ SRS

BIG learning curve for me with this kit
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Old 11th October 2013
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by andym View Post
I must admit I'm totally perplexed about this idea of upping the contrast and using an vivid colour to help with AF. These are Jpeg settings and as we all know are applied when the camera does the conversion to Jpeg.If you shoot RAW these settings do not apply so how can they help with AF

Either I'm being misled or you are.
There is a rationale for this which seems quite plausible to me.

The raw data from the sensor is not viewable as a "picture" as it needs to be demosaiced which includes interpreting the effect of the Bayer filter and applying a Colour space etc. etc. In order to provide the "Live view" and EVF data the camera has to actually do this and produce a format which can be displayed by these raster displays ie. jpg. I believe it also uses data in this form for the Contrast Detection AF. Since any settings such as contrast, colour mode (Vivid etc) set on the camera are seen in the "Live view" then presumably they also affect the data used by the CDAF.

The term "shooting raw" is actually a bit of a misnomer. What we actually do is save the "raw" data files to the memory card rather than the processed jpg files. An ORF "raw file" actually contains, as well as the unprocessed data from the sensor a whole bunch of EXIF files which are much more detailed than the simple EXIF you see in a basic EXIF viewer and which are needed for a "raw converter" to do its job.Interestingly it also includes a jpg thumbnail. The advantages of doing your own "processing from raw" derive mainly from the greater bit depth of the sensor information and the ability to modify the the parameters in the detailed EXIF files regarding camera settings etc.

Well that's my explanation anyway.

Regards.
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  #54  
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevvyf1 View Post
I hope you dont think me rude quoting p. No. but save writing the manual ! I have not yet learned "off heart" function names ... its all stuff from my first post re my telecon with Matt @ SRS

BIG learning curve for me with this kit
Not at all Chevvy, I'm honestly grateful for the clarification.

Like you, the E-M1 is a huge learning curve for me, I've jumped from an E510 to this one.

I've read the manual from front to back however, I'm well aware that there will be things hidden away that I'll never spot, others will though.

Thanks again,

Dave
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Old 11th October 2013
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterBirder View Post
There is a rationale for this which seems quite plausible to me.

The raw data from the sensor is not viewable as a "picture" as it needs to be demosaiced which includes interpreting the effect of the Bayer filter and applying a Colour space etc. etc. In order to provide the "Live view" and EVF data the camera has to actually do this and produce a format which can be displayed by these raster displays ie. jpg. I believe it also uses data in this form for the Contrast Detection AF.
I think it unlikely the user settings will make any difference. All the camera has is the data from the sensor. The camera's firmware will do whatever processing Olympus think necessary in order to optimise the focus accuracy. This is almost certainly going to include some kind of contrast enhancement... but responding to user input just doesn't seem the right way to do it. It would be interesting to hear from the developers, though!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterBirder View Post
The advantages of doing your own "processing from raw" derive mainly from the greater bit depth of the sensor information and the ability to modify the the parameters in the detailed EXIF files regarding camera settings etc.

Well that's my explanation anyway.

Regards.
Bit depth is certainly one advantage... the other main one is that adjustments made by the camera (WB, sharpening, etc.) are not "baked in" to the images.

Steve.
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterBirder View Post
There is a rationale for this which seems quite plausible to me.

The raw data from the sensor is not viewable as a "picture" as it needs to be demosaiced which includes interpreting the effect of the Bayer filter and applying a Colour space etc. etc. In order to provide the "Live view" and EVF data the camera has to actually do this and produce a format which can be displayed by these raster displays ie. jpg. I believe it also uses data in this form for the Contrast Detection AF. Since any settings such as contrast, colour mode (Vivid etc) set on the camera are seen in the "Live view" then presumably they also affect the data used by the CDAF.

The term "shooting raw" is actually a bit of a misnomer. What we actually do is save the "raw" data files to the memory card rather than the processed jpg files. An ORF "raw file" actually contains, as well as the unprocessed data from the sensor a whole bunch of EXIF files which are much more detailed than the simple EXIF you see in a basic EXIF viewer and which are needed for a "raw converter" to do its job.Interestingly it also includes a jpg thumbnail. The advantages of doing your own "processing from raw" derive mainly from the greater bit depth of the sensor information and the ability to modify the the parameters in the detailed EXIF files regarding camera settings etc.

Well that's my explanation anyway.

Regards.
Thanks for this Peter.

All I feel is the first thing that we want a camera to do is to focus on what we want it to.What you see in an EVIL is probably just a representation of what you expect with a delay and processed to how you want it to be(or how the camara show it).

The only way to get it to focus on what you want is manual but we do not always have time for this.

The first action of a camera must be to focus before all processing of an image, if not we are at the mercy of the JPEG conversion or storage of the data of the camera.

I still do not think anything you do to contrast/colour can make any difference to focus speed.

But I might be wrong.

PS answered after to much of the sauce
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by andym View Post
Thanks for this Peter.

All I feel is the first thing that we want a camera to do is to focus on what we want it to.What you see in an EVIL is probably just a representation of what you expect with a delay and processed to how you want it to be(or how the camara show it).

The only way to get it to focus on what you want is manual but we do not always have time for this.

The first action of a camera must be to focus before all processing of an image, if not we are at the mercy of the JPEG conversion or storage of the data of the camera.

I still do not think anything you do to contrast/colour can make any difference to focus speed.

But I might be wrong.

PS answered after to much of the sauce
Don't forget the processor is working all the time to transmit live view images to the EVF/LCD. Any adjustments you make are visible even if you are recording raw only. We know that those changes to colour and contrast won't be applied to the raw file (although they are imbedded in the data for application in Viewer 3 if required) but still they are streamed to us in real time live view, before we even focus the camera. You can see the effects on the live view image (as opposed to the recorded image) by setting the camera to raw only and adjusting colour and contrast. Remember, MFT lenses focus by contrast detection off the sensor, this is how and why these adjustments are able to influence focus and also why the Key Line Art Filter can be used for quasi focus peaking even with raw only selected (art filters are not applied to raw files but are still seen in live view).
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavyG View Post
Not at all Chevvy, I'm honestly grateful for the clarification.

Like you, the E-M1 is a huge learning curve for me, I've jumped from an E510 to this one.

I've read the manual from front to back however, I'm well aware that there will be things hidden away that I'll never spot, others will though.

Thanks again,

Dave

Dave, Lucky, we all have "each other" to learn from - as like food choices, we select different "bits" ... and LUCKY we have this 4M as our "restaurant" to feast in
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by raichea View Post
I think it unlikely the user settings will make any difference. All the camera has is the data from the sensor. The camera's firmware will do whatever processing Olympus think necessary in order to optimise the focus accuracy. This is almost certainly going to include some kind of contrast enhancement... but responding to user input just doesn't seem the right way to do it. It would be interesting to hear from the developers, though!


Bit depth is certainly one advantage... the other main one is that adjustments made by the camera (WB, sharpening, etc.) are not "baked in" to the images.

Steve.
Thanks Steve.
I think in the interest of brevity I over simplified some of my statements.

The raw data from the sensor cannot, I believe be used as it stands to determine contrast. The effect of the Bayer filter is to make each individual photosite (pixel) see only red or green or blue. In order to produce a pixel with meaningful data the processor has to interpolate it's data with that from adjacent pixels. Only then is the data in a form where it can be used to form an image file which can be analysed to measure contrast and to display in real time on the screen or EVF. I clumsily said this was a jpg. What I should have said is " an uncompressed file in a format similar to jpg which can be used by a raster display". It is possible that this file is also at a lower resolution than that used to actually take and record a picture. Remember also that when you actually fire the shutter this process stops and the screen/EVF actually go blank momentarily while the camera processes and records (initially to a buffer) the image data and the files containing all the camera settings (META data/ EXIF).

Regarding the use of raw files what I meant was what you say, I just used different words.

Regards.
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  #60  
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Re: Birds in Flight Bif EM-5 and EM-1

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterBirder View Post
Thanks Steve.
I think in the interest of brevity I over simplified some of my statements.

The raw data from the sensor cannot, I believe be used as it stands to determine contrast. The effect of the Bayer filter is to make each individual photosite (pixel) see only red or green or blue. In order to produce a pixel with meaningful data the processor has to interpolate it's data with that from adjacent pixels. Only then is the data in a form where it can be used to form an image file which can be analysed to measure contrast and to display in real time on the screen or EVF. I clumsily said this was a jpg. What I should have said is " an uncompressed file in a format similar to jpg which can be used by a raster display". It is possible that this file is also at a lower resolution than that used to actually take and record a picture. Remember also that when you actually fire the shutter this process stops and the screen/EVF actually go blank momentarily while the camera processes and records (initially to a buffer) the image data and the files containing all the camera settings (META data/ EXIF).

Regarding the use of raw files what I meant was what you say, I just used different words.

Regards.

Peter, when the man from Bugatti told me "push it into Sport mode and kickdown twice and it will engage both turbo and fly ... " I did as he said and it it flew like an angel ... this was the race weight 110 in polished Ali, engine test bed - I can scan 35 m slides for you if you like

Matt Hope told me some settings to try, which he and Bryce Bradfield used and it enhanced their images captured of aircraft and Birds in Flight ! I hold both these chaps in the same "group" as yourself and the man from Bug - you all know a lot more than I now KNOW - or ever want too KNOW, about the technical design and workings of ??? !

BUT it works
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