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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

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  #31  
Old 30th June 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Great post NN.

Very similar perspective to my own. 94 Corolla with 267,000kms up on her, and I'd prefer to keep it that have a newer BMW/Merc (if I was keeping her - time to let go... ), I play a Tune TWB bass rather than more common Fenders, I rode a FireStorm when mates had 'Blades & R1s, Sony phone rather than iPhone, Olympus rather than Canikon.

Probably quite a similar perspective to many enthusiasts of "minority" (as generally perceived) brands.

Shame on the magazines who operate like this, but of course you're right - as Bobbi Fleckman told Ian Faith - money talks, bullsh1t walks...


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  #32  
Old 30th June 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Gone are the days when they use to sponser F1 racing teams & had the Olympus along the sides of the JPS lotus.
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  #33  
Old 30th June 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

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Originally Posted by Chevvyf1 View Post
Mark, Congratulations on your new camera I thought aboput buy E-PL1 BUT ended up with Tough-810 as its underwater and small for the hols snorkelling (BUT never took a single shot with it underwater and I decided E-5 is enough big camera and that if I bought E-PL1 as well, when would I use it all

I do not want to get too "camera focused" as I have got took Techi focused with other hobbies, and then I spend time worrying that I am doing ? it all right and the joy and spontaneous FUN has gone out of it (golf Skiing horses in Showjumping Team Chasing: Eventing: finally Dressage then my knees gave out ! With Motorbikes I wanted a Ducati Monster and its like a bucking Polo pony to ride ! YEAH love it ... but my Ducati SPS 748 was hard work to ride and I got that pain in the back of my neck, which made me GRUMPY so I sold that one ... Now its the Monster and Olympus !
Chevvy, in action you sound just like my Harley riding, horse riding, scuba diving, absailing daughter, on steroids!

I too once bought an underwater housing for an Oly C-4040 with which I took a picture of the underbelly of my wife swimming towards me from a depth of about half a fathom - not the best picture I've taken but awesome! Being a poor swimmer I had little use for it after that.

Anyway, good luck to you for living your life to the full.
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  #34  
Old 30th June 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Thank you Mark. I will recall a true story that may interest you.

Until a few years ago I wrote a regular monthly column for a major UK boating magazine, and from time to time ran comparative tests on products in my specialist field.

On one occasion I had been running a comprehensive testing programme on more than 30 competing products over a whole sailing season, and by early November had almost put the finished article to bed in time for the big London Boat Show edition. This had been a major project, and the full article covered around thirty pages over two editions, so a lot of work had gone into it. Draft copies had also gone out to the manufacturers concerned, most of which had said they thought the test was extremely fair, and one or two actually asked for advice on product improvements.

Anyhow, just days before the copy deadline I was called to the head office of a large multinational company, which at the time just happened to have a monopoly in the market concerned. Once there I was led to a meeting room by two 'suits', where the suggestion was put to me that I had my figures wrong, and that I needed to "make some adjustments". I knew this was not the case and refused. Next, I was told quite bluntly that I didn't need to publish the article at all, and that they "could make it worth my while to forget the whole idea". This went against everything that I believed in, and left me slightly shocked, but not entirely surprised. Thinking quickly I also realised that if I complied my reputation would be in tatters, so I refused outright. I was then told (or threatened) that if we published, the company would cancel its advertising contract with the magazine forthwith, which at the time was worth about 80,000 per year. I knew that my Editor would back me to the hilt, so I told them to go ahead, left the meeting and reported back to the Editor.

The next day I was called to a second meeting at magazine HQ, where I was told that the company was seeking an injunction to stop us publishing. (They failed, and it was thrown out of court). However, the company did cancel their advertising for eighteen months, and I later found that they had done exactly the same to a French magazine for the same reasons.

Now, you might be thinking that I must have rubbished the manufacturers products, but this was not the case. My tests had simply shown that some other manufacturers products worked just as well, or even slightly better in some cases, and that price was not a reliable guide to performance. The tests also showed that some mid-range products actually worked just as well as premium products from the same brand. In short, the company had a big advertising budget, and for years had persuaded boat owners that their products were the best. All I had done was to show that some other manufacturers products worked just as well, but they didn't want to hear that.

As it happens, losing the advertising business was no big deal, as there were plenty of other companies queuing up to buy the outside back page, but I doubt that it would be so easy now.

I think this just goes to show the kind of pressure that big manufacturers are prepared to put on the press. I think it also shows that any magazine review in current times must be viewed with more than a degree of scepticism, especially where 'niche' products are competing with big brands.

Sorry for going on so long.

NN
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  #35  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Thank you for this interesting account. It is of course probably what we all suspect or know and I wonder if it goes the same for "Which?" publications. If there is any inkling that this could be the case I'll cancel my subscription!

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  #36  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

NN I thoroughly enjoyed your account, from beginning to end, thanks for the detailed account! You are not alone

However I have also worked with product providers in the opposite campaigns - whereby "you let the clients do the talking" ! ... and just maybe Olympus are in this camp ? Maybe Olympus will not go along with "money/advertising talking" ? After all, how many have said, HERE and in E-5 Reviews that the IQ is the best kept secret !

Today "Product Placement" is in TV series (Countryfile and CSi et al) and there are many other ways to Market Sales than Mag Ads ! Going for an AWARD makes Sales and Sales Supported by After Market Marketing (vis e-system user group here) provides a very cost effective upgrade club

These days Olympus Imaging is a massive Commercial multi product Co and DSLR cameras are but a tiny part of Cameras - the Equipment for Operations (on Peeps and making things ) are AWESOME !

I think Olympus believe in "Let the E-5 and Clients do the talking ..."
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  #37  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

I should stress that the manufacturer concerned did not, at any time, complain that the product comparison was unfair to them; it simply didn't say what they wanted to hear because it didn't put them in first place in all categories!

The company was a market leader; their sales force was always told this, and they genuinely believed that their products were the best on the market, although their own R&D would have told them otherwise. And their formidable advertising budget was spent putting this message across to a public which had no way of knowing otherwise. Clearly the company didn't want this mystique destroyed by an article published in a magazine that they felt they 'owned', because they always took the inside or outside back cover for advertising. (Anyone who knows about magazine advertising will tell you that the back cover is the best and most expensive place to advertise).

By and large I believe British magazines are still amongst the best in the world in terms of impartiality; which is why they are so popular in the USA and other English speaking regions; but even in the absence of direct pressure from advertisers there is always a temptation to mark up big brands when scoring subjective matters such as handling, ease of use, comfort and so forth. It is also easy to somehow miss out small, but important details that perhaps only a user would know about. In short, marking brand big 1% down against brand small is just asking for trouble!

This is because anyone thinking of spending a few thousands on a new car, bike or camera understandably wants to think they are getting the best they can for their money, and it is here that comparative scores in magazine tests are so important. Many people will buy a car or bike that is reported to do 2 MPH more than a competitor, even though that figure may be irrelevant on the road. Likewise people will buy a car that is reported to give 1 or 2 MPG better fuel economy than a competitor, even though we all know that economy is heavily influenced by driving style, and there is no way of knowing how the vehicle was driven on test. It is often these subtle differences together with market appeal and brand loyalty that sell products.

On that subject, some here will recall that the Olympus E1 scored an unprecedented 91% when it was tested by AP back in 2003, and was described as a "formidable picture taking machine". Indeed, the review itself couldn't praise the camera enough; despite the fact that, at that time, the E1's 4.9 MP sensor was already behind the competition.

What has happened since though? I love my E1, but there is no doubt that the E3 and E5 provide significant technical advantages; yet the scores never seem to reflect these improvements. Am I the only person to wonder why?

NN
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  #38  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pandora View Post
Chevvy, in action you sound just like my Harley riding, horse riding, scuba diving, absailing daughter, on steroids!

I too once bought an underwater housing for an Oly C-4040 with which I took a picture of the underbelly of my wife swimming towards me from a depth of about half a fathom - not the best picture I've taken but awesome! Being a poor swimmer I had little use for it after that.

Anyway, good luck to you for living your life to the full.
Mark ... But no Harley for me - its a bit slow to me and I like Ducati sound and speed for getting a knee down (scratches on kneesliders 'evidence' the ride ) and I tried Windsurfing on a diving holiday in Malta in 1986 and just could not "get on" with the "thing" ! had to wait at the back of St Julians Bay to be "rescued" ! - does your daughter Windsurf or Powerkite ?

I have some old photos of me Absailing down Little Scout in the Lake District and down a waterfall with Peter White at Langdale
http://www.langdale.co.uk/relax/acti.../highpoint.htm
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  #39  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

With a few bikers on here, the magazine, RiDE might be familiar. At the height of my enthusiasm for bikes & biking - early/mid-90's - this mag quickly became my bible. They brought journalistic impartiality to a new level. I don't know if it's still the same now.

You're totally on the money NN. Yay for forums, eh? Though there is the aspect of human nature that can make some folk reluctant to concede any failing in any of their choices, so everything always has to be taken with a pinch of salt.

The Park Cameras supplement that came with one of the mags I bought has an E-5 tucked away at bittom right if the single Oly page. Everything else is Pens. So I guess it's also the case where sellers are under pressure from brand Big too?

Mark
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  #40  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

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Originally Posted by Phaedrus View Post
The Park Cameras supplement that came with one of the mags I bought has an E-5 tucked away at bittom right if the single Oly page. Everything else is Pens. So I guess it's also the case where sellers are under pressure from brand Big too?

Mark
Retailers like volume, and volume means discounts from suppliers, so they will promote what they know will sell. This is Olympus' biggest problem, as retailers will only give shelf space to products that they can be sure will be sold within a week or two. Stock is a dirty word, and has been for the past thirty years or so.

"Just in time" is the current mantra, which is why it has become so difficult to source less popular items on the high street. Many of the online retailers don't actualy hold the stock themselves, but operate a virtual warehouse, where products are shipped directly from importers to the customer. If you buy computer supplies from the likes of Misco the chances are that you wil recive several different packages form different sources for this very reason. Hence the huge volume of delivery vans clogging up our roads!

NN
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  #41  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Olympus ignored by Olympus?

I want to upgrade from my E-410 but can't afford the top spec E5. Lets see what else is available from the on-line Olympus shop.......

http://shop.olympus.co.uk/e_commerce...l-slr-c-62.htm.

Have Olympus sold out of all other E system cameras. Where in the world can I get an 620?

P
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  #42  
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
Retailers like volume, and volume means discounts from suppliers, so they will promote what they know will sell. ...

"Just in time" is the current mantra, which is why it has become so difficult to source less popular items on the high street. Many of the online retailers don't actualy hold the stock themselves, but operate a virtual warehouse, where products are shipped directly from importers to the customer. If you buy computer supplies from the likes of Misco the chances are that you wil recive several different packages form different sources for this very reason. Hence the huge volume of delivery vans clogging up our roads!

NN
Also we do not "buy" the same - supplement web browse for window shopping - and mouse click for footfall ! I buy mostly off internet now (90%)with a little from local Winchester shops ! and I am not alone
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  #43  
Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

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Originally Posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
Thank you Mark. I will recall a true story that may interest you.

The next day I was called to a second meeting at magazine HQ, where I was told that the company was seeking an injunction to stop us publishing. (They failed, and it was thrown out of court). However, the company did cancel their advertising for eighteen months, and I later found that they had done exactly the same to a French magazine for the same reasons.

NN
A similar thing happened when a British motorcycle magazine gave a bike a bad review in the late 70's.

I also knew a product reviewer for a magazine who was told he could keep the 500 product 'if he liked it'.
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  #44  
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

Well here's the reply from Olympus, make your own assumptions. Apparently I have a "dealer" down on the coast so will check out what stock they have (although being able to view it on Google earth I'm not holding out much hope).

Has anyone managed to find a "local" dealer?.


"The Olympus e-shop thanks you for your email and the interest you show for our products.

We only sell the E-5 on our Online Shop due to a different sell policy than our retailers.

You may wish to contact a local Olympus dealers. This may be done by following the below link:

http://dealerlocator.olympus.eu/Stor...fr&country=All

Should you wish detailed technical information, we suggest that you contact our European Support Team at the following address:

di.support@olympus-europa.com.

Should you have any queries concerning our Online Shop, please do not hesitate to contact us, we shall be most happy to assist you,

Kind Regards,

Jean F.
For the Olympus Online Shop Team"


Paul (there's an E620 out there somewhere with my name on it)
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Old 1st July 2011
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Re: Olympus Ignored By Media & Retailers?

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Originally Posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
Thank you Mark. I will recall a true story that may interest you. ...... NN
Thanks Nigel for your intriguing story which doesn't surprise me.
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