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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

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Old 24th March 2013
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M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

I've been trying to get this straight in my head for some while....so in response to the assertion that M43 always gives a bigger dof I think I've sorted out an answer.......
If you are side by side with another tog using the same focal length and f stop with but the other guy has a larger sensor the dof is the same but the field of view is wider for the other guy with the larger sensor. Your image is cropped as the sensor is smaller - which is the equivalent to using a a longer lens on a larger sensor
If you then take a few steps back to get the same field of view with your smaller sensor then the dof will be greater because of the greater distance to subject.
You can always open the lens up to compensate. So I don't see any handicap at all - unless you can't move back of course.

Sorry...I know this is the relaxing page but I can't see anywhere better to post this. Please comment...I only think I'm right.
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Your logic seems right to me, too, Brian.
It is an argument that always seems to originate from those using full-frame sensors, but then they spend hours correcting their interpretation in PS afterwards anyway, whereas we don't have to
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Sounds good to me but I have 4/3rds only
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Whereas your argument is factually correct it isnt correct toy are using statistics not real world usage.

As a Landscape photographer using wideangle lenses I get great Dof. The focal length does not matter to me its the angle of view does and I get far dof for the same apperture that I do on 120 film camera. Thats why the lenses I have do not have f32 or f45 etc.

This is not new stuff as different formats have been around for some time. On a 10X8" camera appertures like f64 are common.

So as far as I am concerned you are wrong.
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Great...thanks...I feel so much better now that I've grasped this.

Chevvyf1.....I believe 4/3rds and m4/3rds are exactly the same in this context as the sensor sizes are the same.
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Quote:
Originally Posted by brianvickers View Post
Chevvyf1.....I believe 4/3rds and m4/3rds are exactly the same in this context as the sensor sizes are the same.
They are the same just the distance from sensor to lens mount is different really so changing things a lot.
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Alf, we posted at exactly the same time...I wasn't ignoring your comment.
Yes your dof is greater than a FF from the same position using the same focal length and aperture.
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

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Originally Posted by brianvickers View Post
Alf, we posted at exactly the same time...I wasn't ignoring your comment.
Yes your dof is greater than a FF from the same position using the same focal length and aperture.
Brian
Its the same thing that means mobile camera focusing doent need t be that good as Dof is huge due to minute sensor size.
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Yep I agree.

Is there a difference in practical terms then for m4/3 and 4/3 than?
I suspect the lens construction and mount to sensor dimensions take account of this and end up the same....and the m4/3 adaptor compensates for when using 4/3rds lenses on m43?
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Quote:
Originally Posted by brianvickers View Post
I've been trying to get this straight in my head for some while....so in response to the assertion that M43 always gives a bigger dof I think I've sorted out an answer.......
If you are side by side with another tog using the same focal length and f stop with but the other guy has a larger sensor the dof is the same but the field of view is wider for the other guy with the larger sensor. Your image is cropped as the sensor is smaller - which is the equivalent to using a a longer lens on a larger sensor
If you then take a few steps back to get the same field of view with your smaller sensor then the dof will be greater because of the greater distance to subject.
You can always open the lens up to compensate. So I don't see any handicap at all - unless you can't move back of course.

Sorry...I know this is the relaxing page but I can't see anywhere better to post this. Please comment...I only think I'm right.
If you want limited dof and nice bokeh, use a longer focal length and crop tighter so you don't need to step back.

Ian
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Sorry, doesn't quite work that way in the real world. For example using a 50mm f1.4 on a full frame, a fairly standard lens to be using, you'd have to choose the panasonic 25mm f1.4 to match at the same distance, and angle of view. If you double your distance with a 50mm on 4/3, the angle may be matched but the compression of the view would not altering background detail and the composition.
Either way you'll be doubling the depth of field, with a need to open up the lens to match.
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

Exactly this ;
Quote:
Originally Posted by brianvickers View Post
...If you are side by side with another tog using the same focal length and f stop with but the other guy has a larger sensor the dof is the same but the field of view is wider for the other guy with the larger sensor. Your image is cropped as the sensor is smaller - which is the equivalent to some stuff.
but I don't agree with some stuff and that's where all the thread drama happens.
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

The depth of field depends on: focal length, f/stop and distance to the subject. If you keep the subject the same size and use the same f/stop whilst varying the lens the depth of field will be the same but perspective will change.

A good article to read is at Luminous Landscape:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/dof2.shtml

It is a difficult subject to get to grips with. A good way is to go out with some lenses and test subjects and try a similair setup.
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Old 24th March 2013
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Re: M43 means big DoF.....no it doesn't...

A very interesting article....there are several variables that come into play of course ...in this case (the link above) the subject was maintained as the same size in the frame by changing position in relation to the subject.
I think perspective is a function of the position of the camera to the subject....hence if you stand in the same position and use different focal lengths then perspective stays the same but depth of field varies.
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