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EM1 street and the Police

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  • #16
    Re: EM1 street and the Police

    Nice set Ian, like you it never bothers me taking candid pics and to give in is to give in to the narrow minded tabloid public who's idea of important headline news is some guy leaving his wife for another man.

    Saying that I just ordered the E-PL7 for street photography as I find with the Pens you never get a second glance.
    Regards Paul.
    One day I hope to be the person my dogs think I am.

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/paul_silk/

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    • #17
      Re: EM1 street and the Police

      Originally posted by Zuiko View Post
      Maybe this woman has a particular bee in her bonnet about photography and you was just unlucky this time.
      There is also the possibility that she has a reason for the presence of the bee - maybe she has had some bad experience with some other photographer who took and then abused some photos. I very much doubt it, but we should acknowledge the possibility. From Ian's description it sounds as though the Plods handled it very diplomatically. If I were thrown into a panic by something and went to them for support I would be pretty miffed if they just dismissed it and told me not to worry my pretty little head about it. However irrational my panic was.

      John

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      • #18
        Re: EM1 street and the Police

        I agree with what you say John and if she had experienced such an incident previously I can understand her frustration and no doubt the police would have mentioned it as a justifiable reason to stop me.

        The likelihood also if that had been the case if she was that incensed is that she would have approached me in person and had a word.

        At no time did the police even intimate that perhaps I should not take any photos in the town centre or even be careful about what/who I photographed.

        I do hope that as it was an official complaint that the police did feed back to the complainant the results of our chat and the nature of my images.

        Nice camera Paul - I think I might revert back to the EPL5 + Pany 20mm!
        Ian from the Cotswolds
        http://571photography.blogspot.co.uk/

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        • #19
          Re: EM1 street and the Police

          I do a fair amount of street, but lay off during school holidays, to avoid the fuss described above. So far no one has approached me but the OP's actions of showing all the photos on my camera would be my first reply.
          Too many cameras!
          E-500, E-510, EPM1, EPL5, EP3, EP5, OM-D E M10, OM-D E M5, Trip 35mm, Samsung WP10 and Panasonic G6 plus lots of lenses many manual focus.

          Photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/42941818@N07/

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          • #20
            Re: EM1 street and the Police

            I thought it a prudent move to request them to review my images rather them have them ask me, this action certainly diffused any potential touchy interaction and was a clear display of innocence on my part in their eyes.

            It is a real shame when we have to be so mindful of what we shoot/when as many good and essentially historic photos could well be missed - I also wonder how these complainants would react if they were shooting photos of their own children in a public place and another family complained as they thought their children were in the background?
            Ian from the Cotswolds
            http://571photography.blogspot.co.uk/

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            • #21
              Re: EM1 street and the Police

              I sometimes think it's not really photography that is the issue but the Internet. Some people are paranoid about the risk of a picture of their child being posted the Internet. Why, it might be downloaded by Rolf Harris or worse - used by a gang of Albanian slave traders to spirit the child away. Logic might dictate that people of Mr Harris's disposition tend to use specialist websites where the images of children are anything but decently clothed and innocent. The same logic assures us that our children cannot be identified and located from an anonymous photograph. However, worried parents are often anything but logical.
              John

              "A hundredth of a second here, a hundredth of a second there � even if you put them end to end, they still only add up to one, two, perhaps three seconds, snatched from eternity." ~ Robert Doisneau

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              • #22
                Re: EM1 street and the Police

                I firmly believe we need to see more cases of slander being brought against people who make any type of defamatory statements.

                In the common law, the claimant has the burden only of proving that the statement was made by the defendant, and that it was defamatory. These things are generally relatively easy to prove. The claimant is not required to prove that the statement was false. Given that these allegations are often made to the Police, the proof is absolute and recorded.

                Because proving the truth or falsity of the statement is often extremely difficult (and the defendant does not generally have the ability to force the claimant to disclose materials that might help prove it) it is frequently said that the "burden of proof" in English defamation law falls upon the defendant.

                Turning the tables on "these people" who think they can say whatever they like with complete impunity, would please me considerable.
                Graham

                We often repeat the mistakes we most enjoy...

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                • #23
                  Re: EM1 street and the Police

                  Originally posted by Graham_of_Rainham View Post
                  I firmly believe we need to see more cases of slander being brought against people who make any type of defamatory statements.

                  In the common law, the claimant has the burden only of proving that the statement was made by the defendant, and that it was defamatory. These things are generally relatively easy to prove. The claimant is not required to prove that the statement was false. Given that these allegations are often made to the Police, the proof is absolute and recorded.

                  Because proving the truth or falsity of the statement is often extremely difficult (and the defendant does not generally have the ability to force the claimant to disclose materials that might help prove it) it is frequently said that the "burden of proof" in English defamation law falls upon the defendant.

                  Turning the tables on "these people" who think they can say whatever they like with complete impunity, would please me considerable.

                  It would be nice if the Police upon completion of their investigation and discovering there is no basis for the use of their time/involvement could go back to the accuser and caution them about misuse of Police time!

                  If there were situations like this it might help calm the "Call to arms / witchhunt scenario" surrounding photography and those who see it being associated with paedophilia.
                  Ian from the Cotswolds
                  http://571photography.blogspot.co.uk/

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                  • #24
                    Re: EM1 street and the Police

                    Photographers need to defend their rights. If we don't, eventually we'll have non.
                    It's the image that's important, not the tools used to make it.

                    David M's Photoblog

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                    • #25
                      Re: EM1 street and the Police

                      How true David,

                      Here in the UK we are seeing an increase in people challenging photographers as well as areas that no longer allow photos to be taken.

                      I think it is critical that photography freedom is maintained for all not just the press - our countries history has always relied on good documentary coverage of all aspects of life to include street life and without it we lose that rich tapestry of our ancestors way of life.

                      The number of "Jobsworths" in the Security industry has not helped as many do not know or have any interest in the law and threaten/bully people with cameras and it is only when the police become involved that they not the photographers learn of the error of their ways, alas this does also create a dislike of all with cameras bigger than compacts.

                      We need those in power (and there are many avid photographers in Government) to endorse publicly the rights of photography in public places.

                      You would expect the camera manufacturers to be taking an interest as if we become oppressed they lose business!
                      Ian from the Cotswolds
                      http://571photography.blogspot.co.uk/

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                      • #26
                        Re: EM1 street and the Police

                        The stupidity of all this of course is that hardly anyone pays the slightest attention to people taking shots using smartphones - even though some of these smartphones now have half-decent cameras in them. The high-end Nokia Lumia has a 40Mp sensor for example. Bizarre.

                        Interestingly, there is (or was!) a somewhat similar thread today over on u43 which the mods closed down very promptly on the basis that it was "political". I'm not sure what's worse - the problem of over-zealous PC parents or over-zealous forum moderators!

                        I guess it's all a mark of our times - we've regressed from the world I grew up in; a world where freedom of speech and opinion were not trumped by misguided ideas on political correctness and concerns over perceived "offence".
                        Paul
                        E-M1ii, Pen-F and too many lenses
                        flickr
                        Portfolio Site
                        Instagram

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                        • #27
                          Re: EM1 street and the Police

                          I think you'll have luck in some places than in others. In London, a degree of controversy seems to have trained the police to be a little bit sensible. In Manchester, people are used to having cameras around, at least in the city centre, so there's rarely an issue (and incidentally, I consider Manchester to the Hicksville of the North).

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                          • #28
                            Re: EM1 street and the Police

                            A good thing that has come from the Smartphone cameras is that the art galleries are beginning to loosen up and allow one to take pictures of the work if you do not use flash. The guards could not determine the difference between a smart phone and an audioguide so they have given in to common sense.
                            This space for rent

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                            • #29
                              Re: EM1 street and the Police

                              Originally posted by pdk42 View Post

                              Interestingly, there is (or was!) a somewhat similar thread today over on u43 which the mods closed down very promptly on the basis that it was "political". I'm not sure what's worse - the problem of over-zealous PC parents or over-zealous forum moderators!
                              The site owner, Amin, is a nice bloke but he does have a bee in his bonnet about anything remotely political. On the other hand, many of the members there are less polite, restrained and respectful of other viewpoints than we are here, so I understand his position. I haven't visited his site for months, for no other reason than I really spend quite enough time on this one!
                              John

                              "A hundredth of a second here, a hundredth of a second there � even if you put them end to end, they still only add up to one, two, perhaps three seconds, snatched from eternity." ~ Robert Doisneau

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                              • #30
                                Re: EM1 street and the Police

                                Originally posted by DerekW View Post
                                A good thing that has come from the Smartphone cameras is that the art galleries are beginning to loosen up and allow one to take pictures of the work if you do not use flash. The guards could not determine the difference between a smart phone and an audioguide so they have given in to common sense.
                                I thought that Smartphone cameras could only be used for taking selfies?

                                John

                                "A hundredth of a second here, a hundredth of a second there � even if you put them end to end, they still only add up to one, two, perhaps three seconds, snatched from eternity." ~ Robert Doisneau

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