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Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

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  • #16
    Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

    Originally posted by Iansky View Post
    I sympathise with you on this and while Olympus offer existing 4/3rd users who get the EM1 a free adaptor, it still means a lot to pay out.

    There is to my understanding a replacement in line for the EM5 soon, and this plus those who have traded their EM5 kits in against EM1 (myself included) should mean they will be available very soon at knock down prices.

    Given that they will not have PDAF but I have seen some stunning images taken using the EM5 4/3rd lens combinations so it could be an alternative unless you want to go the route of an E5, again now the EM1 is out they too should drop in price.

    Not an ideal solution but certainly a viable one worth considering.

    Good luck

    Ian your so very right ! Look what can be obtained with the EM-5 I admire Bryce and his Flickr has some very stunning images

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/brb_pho...h/10127821843/
    .
    .
    [I].
    .
    I Lurve Walking in our Glorious Countryside; Photography;
    Riding Ducati Motorbikes; Reading & Cooking ! ...


    http://www.flickr.com/photos/photomagicf1_chevvy/sets/

    the ONE photo album

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

      I use two Eye-Fi cards and a Flashair in my three cameras and Wi-Fi in the body would do for me exactly what they do with an ordinary card. That is transfer the images to my Nexus tablet in almost real time to check image quality and act as a back up. All three of my cameras have the capability to use one or both of these cards.

      I bought into m4/3 last year and have spent a lot of money on lenses and bodies. Before I bought the E-P3 I looked long and hard at the new OM-D E-M1 and decided that as a first iteration of phase focus (Is that the right term?) it was a risky purchase. I bought the E-P3 after deciding to wait on an OM-D purchase until the first or even second Firmware update had been announced and the reviews were on longer term ownership, rather than quick test or specification sheet re-writes.

      I suspect that I'll end up with an E-M1 or its follow on model at some point in the next three years. I would change my mind if an E-PL5 follow on model, E-PL5+? had the dual focus capability and good user feedback, like the E-PL5 came out with the same sensor as the OM-D E M5.

      I love all my camera bodies for their differences and similarities and am thoroughly enjoying my new hobby. Each body gets used at least once a week and I take two bodies when Birding in order to have a set up for both walk around and hide work to hand as shots come up.

      Would I have ended up with the amount of kit in DSLR format? No, as my pocket would not stretch to 3 DSLR bodies and 12 lenses.

      To me the strength of m4/3 is that I can take Macro, Telephoto, Portrait, Landscape and any other kind of shot with the right kind of lens and with a body that allows me to change settings easily. At an outlay that would buy me a decent hobby DSLR and couple of similar quality lenses.

      While Olympus and Panasonic are duking it out with camera models of increasing capabilities I merely hope that the beginner level models, like the E-PM1 and 2 continue to upgrade without the price going through the roof. Why? Because that's where the new users will come into m4/3.

      The point and shoot market is coming under severe pressure from increasingly capable phone cameras and for all of the pure camera manufacturers to survive they need to offer an USP, and interchangeable lenses are IMHO 'it'.
      Too many cameras!
      E-500, E-510, EPM1, EPL5, EP3, EP5, OM-D E M10, OM-D E M5, Trip 35mm, Samsung WP10 and Panasonic G6 plus lots of lenses many manual focus.

      Photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/42941818@N07/

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

        Originally posted by bilbo View Post
        Isn't it really a question of physics? A long lens that is also fast will be big and heavy, and so will seem relatively 'unbalanced' on the smaller E-M1 body.
        Olympus needed a very fast tele back in the days of the E-1 and even with the E-5, but with sensor improvements so great compared to those cameras, smaller and lighter slower lenses are perfectly reasonable. A 300mm f/4 would sell like hot-cakes if the price was right and it would probably be about a kilo in weight, or what about a 400 f/5.6 for about the same weight?

        Ian
        Founder and editor of:
        Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
        Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
        Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
        Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

        Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
        Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
        Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
        NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
        sigpic

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

          Originally posted by Lee View Post
          Mike,
          Here's my two pen'worth and I broadly agree. It's all well and good offering something with wi-fi, weather sealing and so on but how many of us really need it. Or maybe it's just you and me! If it's raining, I doubt that I'll wander that far in pursuit of photograph.
          Weather-sealing? I appreciate that it might be unimportant for some users but for me it's a deal-breaker:





          Ciao ... Occasionally soggy John

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

            Originally posted by Ian View Post
            Olympus needed a very fast tele back in the days of the E-1 and even with the E-5, but with sensor improvements so great compared to those cameras, smaller and lighter slower lenses are perfectly reasonable. A 300mm f/4 would sell like hot-cakes if the price was right and it would probably be about a kilo in weight, or what about a 400 f/5.6 for about the same weight?

            Ian
            Totally agree. I was just pointing out that fast lenses are de facto heavy. I just hanker after the 300mm f/2.8.
            Brian

            http://www.flickr.com/photos/12569882@N05/

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

              Originally posted by Ian View Post
              Olympus needed a very fast tele back in the days of the E-1 and even with the E-5, but with sensor improvements so great compared to those cameras, smaller and lighter slower lenses are perfectly reasonable. A 300mm f/4 would sell like hot-cakes if the price was right and it would probably be about a kilo in weight, or what about a 400 f/5.6 for about the same weight?

              Ian
              YES ! Great lenses and looking forward to them arriving - 2014
              .
              .
              [I].
              .
              I Lurve Walking in our Glorious Countryside; Photography;
              Riding Ducati Motorbikes; Reading & Cooking ! ...


              http://www.flickr.com/photos/photomagicf1_chevvy/sets/

              the ONE photo album

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                Originally posted by byegad View Post
                I use two Eye-Fi cards and a Flashair in my three cameras and Wi-Fi in the body would do for me exactly what they do with an ordinary card. That is transfer the images to my Nexus tablet in almost real time to check image quality and act as a back up. All three of my cameras have the capability to use one or both of these cards.

                I bought into m4/3 last year and have spent a lot of money on lenses and bodies. Before I bought the E-P3 I looked long and hard at the new OM-D E-M1 and decided that as a first iteration of phase focus (Is that the right term?) it was a risky purchase. I bought the E-P3 after deciding to wait on an OM-D purchase until the first or even second Firmware update had been announced and the reviews were on longer term ownership, rather than quick test or specification sheet re-writes.

                I suspect that I'll end up with an E-M1 or its follow on model at some point in the next three years. I would change my mind if an E-PL5 follow on model, E-PL5+? had the dual focus capability and good user feedback, like the E-PL5 came out with the same sensor as the OM-D E M5.

                I love all my camera bodies for their differences and similarities and am thoroughly enjoying my new hobby. Each body gets used at least once a week and I take two bodies when Birding in order to have a set up for both walk around and hide work to hand as shots come up.

                Would I have ended up with the amount of kit in DSLR format? No, as my pocket would not stretch to 3 DSLR bodies and 12 lenses.

                To me the strength of m4/3 is that I can take Macro, Telephoto, Portrait, Landscape and any other kind of shot with the right kind of lens and with a body that allows me to change settings easily. At an outlay that would buy me a decent hobby DSLR and couple of similar quality lenses.

                While Olympus and Panasonic are duking it out with camera models of increasing capabilities I merely hope that the beginner level models, like the E-PM1 and 2 continue to upgrade without the price going through the roof. Why? Because that's where the new users will come into m4/3.

                The point and shoot market is coming under severe pressure from increasingly capable phone cameras and for all of the pure camera manufacturers to survive they need to offer an USP, and interchangeable lenses are IMHO 'it'.

                Eloquently said
                .
                .
                [I].
                .
                I Lurve Walking in our Glorious Countryside; Photography;
                Riding Ducati Motorbikes; Reading & Cooking ! ...


                http://www.flickr.com/photos/photomagicf1_chevvy/sets/

                the ONE photo album

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                  Surely the reality check on the OP is that the 520 didn't launch with a 500 tag - it was a bit higher!

                  As Ian has posted there will be non mag bodied weatherproof equivilents in due course and there have been 5 evolutions to the 520 as well - all currently available at sub E-M1 prices
                  E, Pen and OM-D bodies
                  43 m43 and legacy glass
                  loads of flashes and accessories from all the systems

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                    Originally posted by snag2000 View Post
                    ...I'm not bothered that they're making an expensive camera - they always have made them - I'm bothered that there is no option for those who don't need a top of the line device. ...
                    Someone on here will probably pipe up with the exact details but Olympus didn't introduce the E1, E30, E300 all at once; I think it took about 6 years to get the range complete.

                    The PEN range, E-P1, E-PL1, E-PM1 took about 2 years to fill the lineup I believe.

                    With the OM-D range we have only had 18 months since the E-M5 and the second in the range, the E-M1, just realeased. Runour is the OM-D "light" next year. Not bad going to fill the range in about 2 years, so same as the PENs.

                    I think you will find that there will indeed be an option for those who don't need a top of the line device - you will just have to wait a bit longer. Obviously at this stage no one knows the specifications of a lower end OM-D. Once the range is established I would expect to see each one replaced on a rolling basis every year so I am sure you will find a camera that meets your needs and your budget.
                    Cameras: E-M5, E-PM2, OM40, OM4Ti
                    Lenses (M.Zuiko Digital): 7-14mm/F2.8, 12-40mm/F2.8, 40-150mm/F2.8+TC1.4x, 12-50mm/F3.5-6.3, 14-42mm/F3.5-5.6 EZ, M.ZD 40-150 F4-5.6 R, 75-300mm/F4.8-6.7 Mk1, 12mm/F2, 17mm/F1.8
                    Lenses (OM Zuiko): 50mm/F1.2, 24mm/F2, 35mm/F2.8 shift
                    Lenses (OM Fit): Vivitar Series II 28-105mm/F2.8-3.8, Sigma 21-35mm/F3.4-4.2, Sigma 35-70mm/F2.8-4, Sigma 75-200mm/F2.8-3.5, Vivitar Series II 100-500mm/F5.6-8.0, Centon 500mm/F8 Mirror
                    Learn something new every day

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                      Wow, this is the biggest debate I've ever sparked on here. Thanks for all the responses - lots of good points. I did warn initially that it was a bit of a rant and an unfocussed one at that, but good to hear everyone's opinions.

                      I do hope that Olympus introduce a more accessibly priced model in the OM-D line (the Pens are all well and good, but I need a viewfinder and would rather it was integrated) as I think it would really help them get some market share as well as help the likes of me. I'm not averse to buying second hand at all, but that won't help Olympus or the system survive.

                      I'm shocked that there is actually a Jessops in Inverness too! The only place you can buy a camera in the centre of Edinburgh is Currys (no Olympus, although they have Panasonic) or John Lewis (same situation there, last time I looked).

                      As for the EM-1 being overpriced. Well, relatively, it probably isn't. Generally, I'm not sure - I suppose it is a matter of opinion and personal circumstance and whether you make income from your photography. We all want more than we can afford, and 'halo' products are often used in areas such the automotive industry (think Ford GT) - but it's only useful if you have other products for the halo effect to filter down to.

                      For the record, I'm still happy with my E-520 (which I did get a good deal on when I bought it, admittedly). I'd like a little more resolution, but the 16x12s I get from it are perfectly good. The realistically usable top ISO is 400 (800 is okay in some situations, but 1600 is very noisy with lots of banding) but I don't really need much higher than that. The IS works great, the size and weight is fine too. It fits in my hands well and isn't too large to lug around. But we always want new toys, don't we? I often wonder whether gear-lust goes hand in hand with the desire to go out and actually take photos, too. Maybe I don't really need a new camera at all...

                      Mike

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                        You could always shlep down to Calumet in Leith, although I'm not sure of their Olympus holding. But I agree, the selection of camera shops in town is atrocious.
                        Stephen

                        A camera takes a picture. A photographer makes a picture

                        Fuji X system, + Leica and Bronica film

                        My Flickr site

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                          Originally posted by Ian View Post
                          Olympus needed a very fast tele back in the days of the E-1 and even with the E-5, but with sensor improvements so great compared to those cameras, smaller and lighter slower lenses are perfectly reasonable. A 300mm f/4 would sell like hot-cakes if the price was right and it would probably be about a kilo in weight, or what about a 400 f/5.6 for about the same weight?

                          Ian
                          It is well known on here that I value highly the Canon 400mm f5.6 "L" which is a dream to use manually on the OMDs giving better IQ than I have experienced on any Olympus offering. It cost me about a grand, weighs just over a kg, has a focus limiter switch and focuses very fast and fairly quietly on the 7D. This is a twenty year old design, so a lens like this must be a feasible low-cost option for Olympus using up to date technology, let's hope they have it on the horizon.

                          David
                          PBase Galleries:-http://www.pbase.com/davidmorisonimages

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                            Originally posted by Ian View Post
                            If you like what the E-M1 offers but it is out of your price range than I think it is only a matter of time before we see a more affordable OM-D that offers some of the key features that the E-M1 offers. It may not have a sealed alloy body or 10 frames per second shooting and it may not have the 5-axis voice-coil IS, I don't know. But I think it does need PDAF. I'm sure it will come and my bet is that it will be this Spring.

                            Ian

                            That would certainly suit me.

                            I won't quote you on that Ian but I hope that you are right.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                              Presumably the E-M5 will remain in the range for the time being, and so will provide a lower cost alternative to the E-M1?

                              There should also be plenty of used E-M5's coming onto the market at more affordable prices.

                              More importantly, I bought my E-M5 for travelling, and to use alongside my Canon PowerShot G11. (The E5 and its lenses is quite hefty to carry around with the other paraphernalia that I need to take with me.)

                              However, to my surprise I have found that the E-M5 makes my E5 (and the G11) all but redundant, as it offers better functionality than both with much lower noise. The 12 ~ 50 mm zoom is not the best, but it does everything adequately, whilst Macro is pretty good too.

                              This being the case, I would expect there will be quite a few used E3's and E5's coming onto the market in the next few months.

                              The question is, how can Olympus follow the E5 when they already have the E-M5 and E-M1 in the range? And would there be there any point?
                              ---------------

                              Naughty Nigel


                              Difficult is worth doing

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Now the dust has settled... (Rant warning)

                                Originally posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
                                Presumably the E-M5 will remain in the range for the time being, and so will provide a lower cost alternative to the E-M1?

                                There should also be plenty of used E-M5's coming onto the market at more affordable prices.

                                More importantly, I bought my E-M5 for travelling, and to use alongside my Canon PowerShot G11. (The E5 and its lenses is quite hefty to carry around with the other paraphernalia that I need to take with me.)

                                However, to my surprise I have found that the E-M5 makes my E5 (and the G11) all but redundant, as it offers better functionality than both with much lower noise. The 12 ~ 50 mm zoom is not the best, but it does everything adequately, whilst Macro is pretty good too.

                                This being the case, I would expect there will be quite a few used E3's and E5's coming onto the market in the next few months.

                                The question is, how can Olympus follow the E5 when they already have the E-M5 and E-M1 in the range? And would there be there any point?
                                There are no plans to discontinue the E-M5. The E-M1 is a fundamentally different camera, so it does not replace the E-M5.

                                Olympus has already said that there will be no more DSLRs to replace the E-5; the E-M1 is the Four Thirds compatible successor to the E-5 as well as being a flagship Micro Four Thirds camera.

                                Ian
                                Founder and editor of:
                                Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                                Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                                Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                                Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                                Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
                                Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
                                Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
                                NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
                                sigpic

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