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Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

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  • #31
    Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

    Originally posted by Zuiko View Post
    I thought I was acknowledging the point Chris is making.

    As for other forums, I'm sorry that I haven't researched this more fully, but not having an E-M1 it is not so much of an issue for me. Having said that, naturally I am keen that any issues with the new camera are resolved.
    Yes you did and I understood that because I showed what you had said, I did not mean to offend you John. The point I was trying to make, with my frustration showing, was that we do not need more testing to establish if this is real because that has been done and I understand that Olympus are working of on it. We need Olympus to issue a statement before this gets out of hand.
    John

    OM-D E-M1, 12-40 f2.8 Pro, Tamron 14-150mm f5.8, E5, E3, Zuiko 50-200mm SWD, Zuiko 12-60mm SWD, Zuiko ED 70-300mm f5.6, 50mmf2, Zuiko ED 9-18mm f5.6, Sigma 50-500mm f6.3, EC14, EC20, RM-1, VA-1

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    • #32
      Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

      Originally posted by birdboy View Post
      Yes you did and I understood that because I showed what you had said, I did not mean to offend you John. The point I was trying to make, with my frustration showing, was that we do not need more testing to establish if this is real because that has been done and I understand that Olympus are working of on it. We need Olympus to issue a statement before this gets out of hand.
      Don't worry John, I didn't take offense and I do take your point!
      John

      "A hundredth of a second here, a hundredth of a second there � even if you put them end to end, they still only add up to one, two, perhaps three seconds, snatched from eternity." ~ Robert Doisneau

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      • #33
        Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

        Even though it does not affect me (no E-M1) I read with interest some of the details on this issue on one of the other sites. It does appear that with identical settings (in particular NR off) the E-M1 is significantly worse (10x possibly looking at the images) than the E-M5 with regard to noise at long exposure. If true this is going to be a big dissapointment to E-M1 owners. Has there been any statement from Olympus on this?
        Cameras: E-M5, E-PM2, OM40, OM4Ti
        Lenses (M.Zuiko Digital): 7-14mm/F2.8, 12-40mm/F2.8, 40-150mm/F2.8+TC1.4x, 12-50mm/F3.5-6.3, 14-42mm/F3.5-5.6 EZ, M.ZD 40-150 F4-5.6 R, 75-300mm/F4.8-6.7 Mk1, 12mm/F2, 17mm/F1.8
        Lenses (OM Zuiko): 50mm/F1.2, 24mm/F2, 35mm/F2.8 shift
        Lenses (OM Fit): Vivitar Series II 28-105mm/F2.8-3.8, Sigma 21-35mm/F3.4-4.2, Sigma 35-70mm/F2.8-4, Sigma 75-200mm/F2.8-3.5, Vivitar Series II 100-500mm/F5.6-8.0, Centon 500mm/F8 Mirror
        Learn something new every day

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        • #34
          Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

          This guys blog shows it as simply as is needed:

          http://www.seldomscenephotography.co...ong-exposures/

          Regards

          Chris

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

            Originally posted by G2EWS View Post
            This guys blog shows it as simply as is needed:

            http://www.seldomscenephotography.co...ong-exposures/

            Regards

            Chris
            Thanks for posting, Chris, it looks pretty conclusive.
            John

            "A hundredth of a second here, a hundredth of a second there � even if you put them end to end, they still only add up to one, two, perhaps three seconds, snatched from eternity." ~ Robert Doisneau

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

              It's becoming a bit depressing reading about all these issues with the E-M1: noise on long exposures, lockups, funny noises from the IBIS, blurred images etc. Is it officially a dog of a camera to be avoided at all costs yet?

              Looking on the bright side, touch wood, I haven't experienced any of these problems SO FAR, although I never take sharp photos anyway. Perhaps I am not being hard and professional enough on my camera.

              Ron

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              • #37
                Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                This issue of noise on long exposures is interesting and I will be doing my own comparisons now I have some E-M1s.

                Ian
                Founder and editor of:
                Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
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                • #38
                  Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                  Originally posted by G2EWS View Post
                  This guys blog shows it as simply as is needed:

                  http://www.seldomscenephotography.co...ong-exposures/

                  Regards

                  Chris
                  If you look closely at the "noise" on that site you will see that all the patterns are identical. You can even identify the area that the one in the top set comes from in the lower ones. I don't know what it is but it's not noise in the sense I understand. i.e. It's not random.

                  Regards,

                  bpb

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                    Originally posted by Ian View Post
                    This issue of noise on long exposures is interesting and I will be doing my own comparisons now I have some E-M1s.

                    Ian
                    Hi Ian,

                    It is a bit of a shock when you see the noise.

                    I have not pointed out (I don't think?) that it didn't happen with every image I took on a long exposure last week. Which makes it even more bizarre.

                    I upgraded my MBP to LR5.3 on Thursday after importing and converting the days images to dng. Up until this point I had no problems. On Friday I imported the days images and saw the noise which Peter Hartland had been getting all week. He had LR 5.3.

                    I therefore assumed it was 5.3 which is a pre release candidate, causing the error. But on getting back at the weekend, I imported the Friday files into my iMac which is running LR 5.2 and the images still had the noise all over them. I then installed Olympus Viewer and imported as RAW images with the same result.

                    So the conclusion is that it was not doing it to start with, then somehow changed and is now causing the problem. Should I get the chance over next weekend I was going to carry out some more tests.

                    I would be very keen for Olympus to carry out their own tests and see what they find. All we users need is some acceptance that there is a problem which they are working on.

                    I all other respects the EM1 is a fantastic camera.

                    Best regards


                    Chris

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                    • #40
                      Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                      Originally posted by bpb View Post
                      If you look closely at the "noise" on that site you will see that all the patterns are identical. You can even identify the area that the one in the top set comes from in the lower ones. I don't know what it is but it's not noise in the sense I understand. i.e. It's not random.

                      Regards,

                      bpb
                      This is what I found with my ''black dots" related issue. This "noise" appears in the same place. At the time I was shooting LSF as I had LR4.4. I have sort of got round my problem by shooting raw converting to dng and using LR4.4 as these files viewed in this way did not show the "black dots". I now have LR5.2 and cannot see the "black dots" in those same files.

                      What is interesting to me is that the examples given by eric in the seldom Scene photography link uses OV3 to view and display his files. If there is a in camera processing problem then just by viewing them in OV3 as a raw file is the same as seeing them as jpgs. It was Peterbirder that has raised this vailid point. in post #37 of http://e-group.uk.net/forum/showthre...206#post262206

                      When I look at jpg files with this noise I cannot help but think that they seem larger in file size.

                      My own take on all of this is that the "noise" we see is pixels that have been given the value of zero hence black dots and that somehow they are being added by the in camera and OV3 software. They do not appear as black dots in brighter exposed pictures because there is some processing going on that looks at adjacent pixels and interpolates a non-zero value.

                      Maybe this sounds too crazy and I have been watching too many JFK documentary's lately.
                      John

                      OM-D E-M1, 12-40 f2.8 Pro, Tamron 14-150mm f5.8, E5, E3, Zuiko 50-200mm SWD, Zuiko 12-60mm SWD, Zuiko ED 70-300mm f5.6, 50mmf2, Zuiko ED 9-18mm f5.6, Sigma 50-500mm f6.3, EC14, EC20, RM-1, VA-1

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                      • #41
                        Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                        Originally posted by bpb View Post
                        If you look closely at the "noise" on that site you will see that all the patterns are identical. You can even identify the area that the one in the top set comes from in the lower ones. I don't know what it is but it's not noise in the sense I understand. i.e. It's not random.

                        Regards,

                        bpb
                        Perfectly correct, but it was easier to call it noise.

                        I believe the problem is associated with the same problem you get with heat on a sensor.

                        Best regards

                        Chris

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                          Out of interest I did some test long exposure test comparisons between the EM-5 and GH-3.
                          The results were identical, both noise free at even 60 sec exposures at ISO 200 with no NR selected.

                          I can understand folks frustration at the long exposure noise issue with the EM-1.

                          Paul

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                          • #43
                            Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                            The E-M5 and GH3 have the same sensor, so no surprise there. It has been indicated to me that the GX7 sensor is not very good in long exposure situations, although there is no indication that this sensor is related to E-M1's.

                            I am beginning to suspect that the increased sensitivity of the sensors in the GX7 and the E-M1 are at the cost of poorer long exposure quality.

                            Ian
                            Founder and editor of:
                            Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                            Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                            Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                            Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                            Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
                            Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
                            Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
                            NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
                            sigpic

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                            • #44
                              Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                              We may have the answer with this upgrade

                              http://www.43rumors.com/olympus-russ...-exposure-fix/

                              Fingers crossed.

                              Regards

                              Chris

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Lots of Noise On Long Exposures

                                Originally posted by G2EWS View Post
                                We may have the answer with this upgrade

                                http://www.43rumors.com/olympus-russ...-exposure-fix/

                                Fingers crossed.

                                Regards

                                Chris
                                You beat me to it!
                                Dave

                                E-M1 Mk2, Pen F, HLD-9, 17, 25, 45, 60 macro, 12-40 Pro, 40-150 Pro, 12-50, 40-150, 75-300, MC-14, MMF-3 (all micro 4/3rds), 7-14 (4/3rds), 50, 135 (OM), GoPro Hero 3, Novo/Giottos/ Manfrotto supports. Lowepro, Tamrac, Manfrotto, and Billingham bags.

                                External Competition Secretary, Cwmbran PS & Welsh Photographic Federation Judge

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