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Hyperfocal Distance

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  • Hyperfocal Distance

    This website looks really good for working out the Hyperfocal Distance, so I made up a card with focal lengths and f-stops I commonly use for landscape work and had a try out, but something isn't right. Here's an example with the E1 and the 12-60.

    Exif: 24mm, F9, so according to the chart the hyperfocal distance should be 4.5 metres.

    The rock in the lower left is about 5 metres away so I focussed on it.
    FullImage.jpg

    Here's a 100% crop of the rock:
    2Metre_100percent.jpg
    Not pin sharp, but ok

    Here's the village in the distance:
    distant_100percent.jpg

    Looks pretty OOF to me, but my understanding is if I focus on the hyperfocal distance, everything from closer than that to infinity should be in focus. Does anyone have any tips/advice/clues?
    John

    m4/3: E-P2, EM-5, 100-300, 14-42mm 12-50mm, 45mm, panny 14mm. 4/3: 7-14 + Flashes & tripods & stuff

    "Take nothing but pictures and leave nothing but footprints".

    Flickr gallery

  • #2
    Re: Hyperfocal Distance

    Fair comment.. doesn't quite seem to do it - as you say, slightly out at infinity.

    However this site

    http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tut...calculator.htm

    has a more rigid dof calculator, and if you set it for a 20 inch print viewed from 50cm with 20/20 vision (and maybe that is more like the situation when pixel peeking on a big monitor) then it looks like like the hyperfocal distance would be further away..

    Pete
    Look, I'm an old man. I shouldn't be expected to put up with this.


    Pete's photoblog Misleading the public since 2010.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Hyperfocal Distance

      Thanks Pete, that's a better site, I clearly need to do some experimenting with what is acceptable sharpness, the figures I got are a long way out.

      That 20/20 vision bit is interesting. A sensitive perfectionist may insist on you having an eye test before letting you see his photos. If you're 20/20 you aren't allowed to see them because you'll think they're OOF
      John

      m4/3: E-P2, EM-5, 100-300, 14-42mm 12-50mm, 45mm, panny 14mm. 4/3: 7-14 + Flashes & tripods & stuff

      "Take nothing but pictures and leave nothing but footprints".

      Flickr gallery

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Hyperfocal Distance

        Just been watching a David Noton DVD, very inspiring it is. He has a hyperfocal distance chart on his site, davidnoton.com but it is for full frame lenses.
        Would it be the same for 4/3 lenses? If not, anyone know of where I can get a chart for 4/3 lenses?
        I have searched the forum and there is some stuff about DOF but I couldn't find a chart.
        Just a shame that there is not a scale on each lens as there used to be in the olden days.
        sigpicDave

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Hyperfocal Distance

          Originally posted by sapper View Post
          Just been watching a David Noton DVD, very inspiring it is. He has a hyperfocal distance chart on his site, davidnoton.com but it is for full frame lenses.
          Would it be the same for 4/3 lenses? If not, anyone know of where I can get a chart for 4/3 lenses?
          I have searched the forum and there is some stuff about DOF but I couldn't find a chart.
          Just a shame that there is not a scale on each lens as there used to be in the olden days.
          Hyperfocal distance basically means focusing on the nearest point where the dof beyond the subject just makes infinity. My articles on Four Thirds and apertures:

          http://fourthirds-user.com/2011/04/a...our_thirds.php

          ..shows that compared to full frame, you will get equivalent full frame DOF by halving the full frame focal length and halving the f-number.

          So you should be able to use that to ready reckon from a full frame chart.

          By the way, what you see as in focus and not in focus is all relative. If you crop severely, and you have enough resolution, what originally looked sharp will look blurred depending on how you view it. This is demonstrated in my latest article all about lens apertures:

          http://dpnow.com/7975.html

          These two illustrations from the article serve the point:



          Depth of field is all relative. Everything above looks to be sharp, but zoom in on the same image...



          ..and you can see that the background is actually fairly blurry, while the foreground is sharp.

          Hope that helps,

          Ian
          Founder and editor of:
          Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
          Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
          Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
          Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

          Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
          Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
          Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
          NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Hyperfocal Distance

            Originally posted by Ian View Post
            Hyperfocal distance basically means focusing on the nearest point where the dof beyond the subject just makes infinity. My articles on Four Thirds and apertures:

            http://fourthirds-user.com/2011/04/a...our_thirds.php

            ..shows that compared to full frame, you will get equivalent full frame DOF by halving the full frame focal length and halving the f-number.

            So you should be able to use that to ready reckon from a full frame chart.


            Hope that helps,

            Ian
            Not sure if it does.
            If the chart for FF says 24mm lens @ f8 gives a hyperfocal distance of 2.4m would a 4/3 lens at 12mm need f16 give the same hyperfocal distance?
            sigpicDave

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Hyperfocal Distance

              Originally posted by jdal View Post
              This website looks really good for working out the Hyperfocal Distance, so I made up a card with focal lengths and f-stops I commonly use for landscape work and had a try out, but something isn't right. Here's an example with the E1 and the 12-60.

              Exif: 24mm, F9, so according to the chart the hyperfocal distance should be 4.5 metres.

              The rock in the lower left is about 5 metres away so I focussed on it.
              [ATTACH]510[/ATTACH]

              Here's a 100% crop of the rock:
              [ATTACH]512[/ATTACH]
              Not pin sharp, but ok

              Here's the village in the distance:
              [ATTACH]511[/ATTACH]

              Looks pretty OOF to me, but my understanding is if I focus on the hyperfocal distance, everything from closer than that to infinity should be in focus. Does anyone have any tips/advice/clues?

              Hi John the distant houses could very well be soften by heat haze, couldn't say really about the rock not being in focus though. At f9 with a 24mm lens should have given you most in focus I would say.

              Dave
              My Published Book: http://www.blurb.com/my/book/detail/2771168

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                Originally posted by sapper View Post
                Not sure if it does.
                If the chart for FF says 24mm lens @ f8 gives a hyperfocal distance of 2.4m would a 4/3 lens at 12mm need f16 give the same hyperfocal distance?
                Halve the focal length and the f-number (not the aperture size) so that gives 12mm @f/4. The hyperfocal distance is about ten and half feet.

                Ian
                Founder and editor of:
                Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
                Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
                Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
                NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
                sigpic

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                  I have been focusing one third of the way into the scene with all lenses.Will Hyperfocal Distance focus improve the sharpness in my landscapes ?
                  Thanks
                  John

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                    I
                    Originally posted by ozzie View Post
                    I have been focusing one third of the way into the scene with all lenses.Will Hyperfocal Distance focus improve the sharpness in my landscapes ?
                    Thanks
                    John
                    It depends on what focal length and aperture you are using.

                    Ian
                    Founder and editor of:
                    Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                    Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                    Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                    Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                    Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
                    Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
                    Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
                    NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                      I find most of my shots are between F11 and F16 on the 12-60 and mostly F11 on 7-14 and I have always pre focused one third into the scene
                      Thanks John

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                        Originally posted by ozzie View Post
                        I find most of my shots are between F11 and F16 on the 12-60 and mostly F11 on 7-14 and I have always pre focused one third into the scene
                        Thanks John
                        By f/8 you are starting to lose resolution through diffraction softening. f/8 is like f/16 on full frame - do you need more depth of field than that? At a moderate wide angle of 18mm, at f/8, the hyperfocal distance is down to 9 feet. At 12mm it's down to 4 feet.

                        Ian
                        Founder and editor of:
                        Olympus UK E-System User Group (http://e-group.uk.net)
                        Four Thirds User (http://fourthirds-user.com)
                        Digital Photography Now (http://dpnow.com)
                        Olympus camera, lens, and accessory hire (http://e-group.uk.net/hire)

                        Twitter: www.twitter.com/ian_burley
                        Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/dpnow/
                        Pinterest: www.pinterest.com/ianburley/
                        NEW: My personal BLOG ianburley.com
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                          Originally posted by Ian View Post
                          By f/8 you are starting to lose resolution through diffraction softening. f/8 is like f/16 on full frame - do you need more depth of field than that? At a moderate wide angle of 18mm, at f/8, the hyperfocal distance is down to 9 feet. At 12mm it's down to 4 feet.

                          Ian
                          Checking with exposureplot I find I am a f8 maniac. The vast majority of my snaps are done at f8 +- 1 stop.

                          Creature of habit?

                          Pete
                          Look, I'm an old man. I shouldn't be expected to put up with this.


                          Pete's photoblog Misleading the public since 2010.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                            Originally posted by jdal View Post
                            <snip> I made up a card with focal lengths and f-stops I commonly use for landscape work and had a try out, but something isn't right. <snip>
                            I put togeather an XL sheet that produces a chart, by entering the lens details, CofC etc...

                            If you want a copy send an e-mail and I'll send you it.

                            Graham

                            We often repeat the mistakes we most enjoy...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Hyperfocal Distance

                              Originally posted by snaarman View Post
                              Checking with exposureplot I find I am a f8 maniac. The vast majority of my snaps are done at f8 +- 1 stop.

                              Creature of habit?

                              Pete
                              Not really, I suspect you're trying to get the best out of your lenses, even if you're doing it subconsciously.

                              Checking Lightroom the vast majority of mine are f5.6 to f8.
                              It's the image that's important, not the tools used to make it.

                              David M's Photoblog

                              Comment

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