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Old 15th March 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

https://www.dpreview.com/news/394391..._dpr_nl_303_23

Actually big:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/689337..._dpr_nl_303_24

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Old 15th March 2018
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

It was only a matter of time. Nikon will almost certainly do the same. I think Sony's aggressive pricing of the new A7iii (well, aggressive in the US at least - $1999 or about £1500 at current exchange rates) tells me that they're out to grab as much market share as they can before the big boys muscle in.
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Old 15th March 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

Hopefully, Olympus will see this as a threat.

Harold
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Old 15th March 2018
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

If you look at the graphs, the number of cameras sold world-wide, mirrored and mirrorless, is in decline. The casual photographer is more than happy with the phone in their pocket that can also connect to Instagram, Twitter etc, and make calls and/or text.
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Old 15th March 2018
Harold Gough Harold Gough is offline
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
If you look at the graphs, the number of cameras sold world-wide, mirrored and mirrorless, is in decline. The casual photographer is more than happy with the phone in their pocket that can also connect to Instagram, Twitter etc, and make calls and/or text.
That's the same trend as with phones a few years back. Not everyone is obsessed with having the latest model, such that the market becomes saturated.

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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

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Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
If you look at the graphs, the number of cameras sold world-wide, mirrored and mirrorless, is in decline. The casual photographer is more than happy with the phone in their pocket that can also connect to Instagram, Twitter etc, and make calls and/or text.
Yes, but what growth there is is in mirrorless. It's still a big market too, so 50% (Canon's target) represents a huge revenue potential. In FF mirrorless Canon and Nikon have been sleeping for four years whilst Sony has been building a strong base unopposed. Just dumb.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harold Gough View Post
Hopefully, Olympus will see this as a threat.

Harold
Well, FF and m43 do have some separation so it's nothing like the threat that Sony will see. There is some overlap for sure, but TBH Sony FF is already a threat. In the US, the A7iii is not a lot more expensive than the EM1ii and Panasonic G9.

I think m43 stlll has advantages over FF:

- Smaller and lighter in general (although the latest Pro lenses are blurring the limits to some degree). In principle, this will always be the case - covering a sensor 4x the size will always need more glass.

- Better for long-lens use. Crop factor helps a lot. The 300mm f4 is a 600mm equiv FF lens and such beasts are huge.

- Enormous lens catalogue. Even Sony FF, after 4 years, is a long way behind in coverage and quality.

- Price - even though m43 is now more expensive than it's ever been, it's still cheaper, esp in terms of top-quality lenses compared to FF.

- Camera features - my E-M1ii will still do things that Sony A7 cameras won't do - LiveComp/View, Focus Stacking, 6.5 stops of IBIS

Of course, many people will come to different conclusions - but I doubt having Canon or Nikon FF equivalents to Sony will make that much of a dent in Olympus.
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

The knee jerk response is to laugh at them for being so late, but Canon has massive resources so Iím not laughing; while Nikon, although small and in financial trouble globally, has a close relationship with Sony and they might be working quite closely together. Anyway, Iíll leave that to all those armchair CEOs who are able to spend so much time on dpreview (680 comments, and counting)

It will be very interesting to see what decision Canon make about their bayonet. To capitalise fully on the size and weight advantages of mirrorless they should of course leave all their installed base in the gutter and introduce a new lens range. That would require use of adapters for the old gear, with attendant failure risks of complexity, leaks etc. Alternatively they could stick with the old, and Sony would forever have a (admittedly modest) size and weight advantage.
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

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Originally Posted by pdk42 View Post

- Camera features - my E-M1ii will still do things that Sony A7 cameras won't do - LiveComp/View, Focus Stacking, 6.5 stops of IBIS
By "focus stacking" you mean in-camera stacking (four frames?). Serious stacking, mainly for macro, is a computer job and any camera is equally capable. I have just invested in a potential tube lens for stacking with my A7R.

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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

This is the graphing to which I was referring, as seen in PetaPixel this morning:
https://petapixel.com/2018/03/14/dea...eid=2a426fcff6
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Old 15th March 2018
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

No matter how light Canon make a mirror less, one on a 600f4 mkII will never compare to Olympus + 300pro It's a joy to use something so light .
Rob.
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Old 15th March 2018
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
This is the graphing to which I was referring, as seen in PetaPixel this morning:
https://petapixel.com/2018/03/14/dea...eid=2a426fcff6
I'm not sure I agree with their analysis of that CIPA data - it's hard to say without seeing back before 2012.
The drop between 2016-17 is only 100K - that looks like a leveling out of demand not necessarily a long term decline.

A long time ago I shot film but the cost of equipment, film and processing meant I went for the classic 3 rolls of film a year in a point and shoot for many years.
I then got my first digital point and shoot when they hit around 2MP and could produce a half sensible 6x4 (2003). Later upgrading to a 5MP then a 10MP.
I got my first DSLR to upgrade from point and shoot after the price point dropped and the resolution improved (around 2009)
I then moved to mirrorless for reasons of portability in 2013.

In tandem I got a camera phone in 2003 - something like 320x200 and have steadily improved since then.

My interest in photography as a hobby grew directly out of having a camera phone and wanting better pictures and more control.
My decision to go mirrorless was based around wanting to take good pictures all the time with equipment that didn't need a rucksack

I think the Instagram phone generation are ripe for upgrades to more capable cameras. In general more people are taking more photographs which one would hope must drive demand for more cameras not just phones.

I nearly got an EOS-M when I got my E-PL5. I'm very glad I didn't but I'm pleased to see Canon joining in - it should help to improve the choice for everyone and push the technology onwards.
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

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Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
The casual photographer is more than happy with the phone in their pocket that can also connect to Instagram, Twitter etc, and make calls and/or text.
That's the rub..........

I don't think WE are casual photographers, certainly not with several grands worth hanging round our necks.

I am casual when I just carry the TG-5, still not cheap either...........

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Old 15th March 2018
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Re: Canon to Go Big in Mirrorles

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Originally Posted by MJ224 View Post
That's the rub..........

I don't think WE are casual photographers, certainly not with several grands worth hanging round our necks.

I am casual when I just carry the TG-5, still not cheap either...........

Mj
For me the cap fits, perfectly. Very casual!
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