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  #16  
Old 12th May 2019
Jim Ford Jim Ford is offline
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Re: Computer advise.

ISTRC that using a SSD for virtual memory (swap space) is not a good idea, as SSDs wear out with lots of R/W cycles. SSDs are good for quick start-up of the O.S. and programs. As I stated earlier, if you have sufficient RAM, then virtual RAM isn't needed.

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  #17  
Old 12th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

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Originally Posted by shenstone View Post



As already mentioned make sure you have at least 1 SSD. if it's going to be the only SSD and that is where programs and Operating system will be then I would suggest at least 240/256 Gb. I run 2 SSD's one for OS and programs, one for cache and pagefiles, and things I am working on right now, especially video - net result 2-3 second windows load time even on my old processor and I don't see IO wait as a significant issue.




Andy
So for example if I load a program will it default to load on the SSD?

Also has anyone any thoughts on Optane memory.
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  #18  
Old 12th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

For a quick intro into Optane memory try https://www.howtogeek.com/317294/wha...optane-memory/

I've found this site very handy for many, many queries on various platforms - PC, Apple and Android, to mention a few - over the last three years. A virtual mine of information with pointers to other relevant links.
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  #19  
Old 12th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Ford View Post
ISTRC that using a SSD for virtual memory (swap space) is not a good idea, as SSDs wear out with lots of R/W cycles. SSDs are good for quick start-up of the O.S. and programs. As I stated earlier, if you have sufficient RAM, then virtual RAM isn't needed.

Jim
Hi Jim Its a consideration but not a big one these days IMO. Most of the disk manufacturers have done a great job in their optimisation processes which is why the big name PC suppliers have no worries selling PC's just with SSD's in them. My second SSD is just for scratch and working anyway so I would not care if it degraded its a simple swap

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Originally Posted by andym View Post
So for example if I load a program will it default to load on the SSD?
Windows does that by drive / library location not hardware type. Programs will load wherever your default program files directory is unless you tell them to load elsewhere. in a normal setup your OS and programs are on the C:\ drive. that will be the default and if it's an SSD then ...

Regards
Andy
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  #20  
Old 12th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

Programs will install onto the drive you specify during their installation. The default option (unless you go through the custom install) is usually the C: drive. You can specify where the swap file is though and change it later if you want to.
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  #21  
Old 12th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Ford View Post
ISTRC that using a SSD for virtual memory (swap space) is not a good idea, as SSDs wear out with lots of R/W cycles. SSDs are good for quick start-up of the O.S. and programs. As I stated earlier, if you have sufficient RAM, then virtual RAM isn't needed.

Jim
Virtual memory is still needed Jim, but not used very much. That said, the more RAM you have the bigger the Page File recommended by Windows.

I actually have my Page File set to a separate physical SSD drive which makes the machine even quicker. I have not had any problems yet, touch wood, and my drives show 100% life remaining after nearly three years.
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  #22  
Old 18th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

I wouldn't bother upgrading anything a few years old. There are a lot of nasty exploits around now that need regular driver updates to be safe. Beyond a few years, the manufactures no longer bother, so even with W10 up to date, there can still be vulnerabilities. The motherboard, processor, RAM, ROM, buses and drives all tend to be optimized to work together. Upgrading odds and sods won't give the same speed as as a fully optimized system of the same generation.
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  #23  
Old 19th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

A while ago now I got to the point where my PC was struggling on PS so I decided to replace it as an upgrade was limited in terms of possibilities and not good value. Years ago I always built my own PCs from scratch, which at the time was fun and frolics to say the least, and I decided to go back to that way of working as it is now much, much easier. It enables you to configure a machine the way you want it and has the added plus of a vanilla machine with none of the bloatware that machine manufacturers insist on installing.

So to cut a long story short what I have is
> Intel i7 running at 4.2 GHz
>16GB Ram
> NVidia graphic card with 4GB ram
>256GB m.2 drive as my C drive
>560GB SSD for LR & PS scratch and LR cat backup plus preview files
>2TB HDD for general files and older image files
>1TB hybrid HDD for more recent images files
> all in a large case with lots of room for cooling and expansion

The latter two drives I need to look as I'm filling them up and I'm considering the various options which may include another SATA controller to enable more drives. Still thinking about that.

The trick to doing this is component compatibility which is hard to determine. Happily there are component providers who have the compatibility charts and knowledge so you can check with them before buying. I used a company called Novatech who were excellent and even saved me money on my graphics card as my choice was more for video it turned out and a slightly cheaper one was actually better for photography work in PS.

The biggest single improvement is RAM. For me 16GB is minimum and if funds allow go to 32GB although the advantage curve flattens off above 16GB so it's a personal choice with finances looming large. Configuration of LR and PS matters as well with scratch disks on a separate spindle giving noticeable performance gains.

Having separate video RAM is good as it frees up machine RAM for pure OS and number crunching with the graphics work being done in a separate area utilising the GPU in an optimal manner. PS makes increasing use of that for some things so it is a real help at times.

A neglected area is, as someone else mentioned, the monitor. After building my PC, which is a rocket ship, I added a high end BenQ monitor which is glorious but expensive.

I have not mentioned the OS. That is W10 which I consider to be excellent. It is fast and stable and, contrary to popular belief, is pretty configurable and controllable. It has already been mentioned for example that you can control updates and there is no need to have them interrupting your work at all. I used to be in computing/software and it was UNIX/LINUX for large enterprise machines and Windows for desktops and laptops as the two could work together superbly in a controllable manner.

Doing it this was is great fun although I appreciate it is not for everyone.


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  #24  
Old 19th May 2019
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Re: Computer advise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Clarke View Post
I wouldn't bother upgrading anything a few years old. There are a lot of nasty exploits around now that need regular driver updates to be safe. Beyond a few years, the manufactures no longer bother, so even with W10 up to date, there can still be vulnerabilities. The motherboard, processor, RAM, ROM, buses and drives all tend to be optimized to work together. Upgrading odds and sods won't give the same speed as as a fully optimized system of the same generation.
W10 is fully supported on all compatible hardware of any age and will continue to be supported for some time yet. That was the whole idea of W10; to avoid periodic obsolescence of operating systems, rather like the Apple Mac system, but time will tell how long this lasts,

I agree that up-to-date hardware will provide best performance but this is nowhere near as critical as it was twenty years ago.

I have successfully installed W10 x64 on an HP 7800 machine fitted with an Intel Core 2 Duo CPU running at 2.66 GHz and 8 GB RAM. This machine was originally supplied with Vista x32 pre-installed but this was quickly replaced with Xp. I later installed W7 x64 Pro onto a 128 GB SSD configured as C:\ Drive and then recently installed W10 x64 Pro.

This computer was built in 2007 so it is quite old in computing terms, but with the SSD installed it is very nippy for most tasks, and is actually much faster than it was running Windows 7 on the same SSD.

That said I wouldn't waste too much time on any machine that only supports 32 bit software as RAM will effectively be limited to about 2.5 GB regardless of how much physical RAM you install.

I should add; we have several HP 8300 Elite machines fitted with SSD's, i5 and i7 third generation CPU's and between 8 and 32 GB of RAM. These are all extremely stable workhorses which we bought when new but are now available used/reconditioned for very reasonable sums.
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