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The lounge Relax, take a break from photo and camera talk - have a chat about something else for a change. Just keep it clean and polite!

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Old 16th June 2017
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Two camera test.

Tried the D810 with 28-300 at 28mm against he M5 with 14-42 at 14mm
Both at F8.
Comparing the oly to a 100% crop from the D810 we were in fuzzy vision land with the oly.
Thats the Oly problem ..take a group of 20 people ..they try to take a crop of a couple of cute kids and you cannot. Its not there .
So wont be swoping my 5 Nikons for 5 Olys any time soon though if you want to play about in RAW you could make some improvements I am sure .
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
Tried the D810 with 28-300 at 28mm against he M5 with 14-42 at 14mm
Both at F8.
Comparing the oly to a 100% crop from the D810 we were in fuzzy vision land with the oly.
Thats the Oly problem ..take a group of 20 people ..they try to take a crop of a couple of cute kids and you cannot. Its not there .
So wont be swoping my 5 Nikons for 5 Olys any time soon though if you want to play about in RAW you could make some improvements I am sure .
Oh dear - here we go again...
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

OK benefit of the doubt for the other posts but this is just stirring on a Oly forum so before John closes the thread I'll make a quick comment.
Surely both cameras have a zoom function to be able to isolate the two kids from the crowd to get a much better shot than cropping to 100%?
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Not entirely sure how an old E-M5 can fairly be compared to a D810.
A better comparison might be the E-M1 mkII against the D810.

Or another way to put it, I ditched my D4 et al for the E-M1 mkII

Or, in fact, another way to put it, choose what works for you and your clients and don't bother shouting from the rooftops, because no one else is you, and anyone else's clients don't have the same requirements or standards as yours.

Or something like that.
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
Tried the D810 with 28-300 at 28mm against he M5 with 14-42 at 14mm
Both at F8.
Comparing the oly to a 100% crop from the D810 we were in fuzzy vision land with the oly.
Thats the Oly problem ..take a group of 20 people ..they try to take a crop of a couple of cute kids and you cannot. Its not there .
So wont be swoping my 5 Nikons for 5 Olys any time soon though if you want to play about in RAW you could make some improvements I am sure .
Comparisons often fail when they are arbitrary and unable to be reproduced.

DxO and all the competent testers ( not reviewers ) undertake the test in isolation, providing sound quantifiable information.

Most everything else is simply a matter of opinions.
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Many of us are single brand users and therefore do not compare equipment in the same way as others seem to do. We are more likely to be happy with our lot.................unless we get hung up on what these tests reveal. We use what we use for a variety of reasons, IQ being just one. I will never go full frame as m43rds cameras and the excellent mZuiko glass do want I want them to do, on many levels.
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

I just use mine for taking photos, couldn't care less about comparisons. It suits me for weight, size and quality of results. Want to produce wall size prints, then buy something with a full sized sensor. What do I use?, it's an Olympus ***** m4/3
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
Tried the D810 with 28-300 at 28mm against he M5 with 14-42 at 14mm
Both at F8.
Comparing the oly to a 100% crop from the D810 we were in fuzzy vision land with the oly.
Thats the Oly problem ..take a group of 20 people ..they try to take a crop of a couple of cute kids and you cannot. Its not there .
So wont be swoping my 5 Nikons for 5 Olys any time soon though if you want to play about in RAW you could make some improvements I am sure .
There are many observations you could make about this so called comparison but without any images qualify your words you stumble at the first step.
I could claim to have made a comparison between two different format camera bodies with mismatched glass but without any sort of evidence there is no credibility at all... nothing, zip.
That raises the question, why are you even bothering to post these unsubstantiated opinions?
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

I dont think there is any "here we go again" just that the physics does not allow the cramming of 20 people onto a 4/3 sensor as well as spreading those over Fx..its just horses for courses ...I am sure that with a good 3-400mm lens the format is good for birding where pixels on image is the key ..for my commercial work it just would not be viable though I must admit that joe public knows nothing of image quality being satisfied with his mobile phone.
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
Tried the D810 with 28-300 at 28mm against he M5 with 14-42 at 14mm
Both at F8.
Comparing the oly to a 100% crop from the D810 we were in fuzzy vision land with the oly.
Thats the Oly problem ..take a group of 20 people ..they try to take a crop of a couple of cute kids and you cannot. Its not there .
So wont be swoping my 5 Nikons for 5 Olys any time soon though if you want to play about in RAW you could make some improvements I am sure .
This thread has been flagged up as a reported post, possibly because there is a concern that the debate is, or will, get out of hand.

First of all, the comparison of these two cameras, is of very limited value as they are very different in price and specification. But clearly the Nikon user is not experienced with Olympus kit anyway and is not using the E-M5 properly to start with; f/8 is already well into diffraction territory, whereas f/8 on an FX camera isn't. The comparison would be better off done at f/5 on the Olympus. Then again, we have no idea of how the comparisons were done - hand held, on a tripod, if on the latter was the IS switched off as advised?

There should be no doubt among anyone sensible that, all things considered, the Nikon D810 should be significantly superior. That said, the relatively dismissive description of the E-M5 result does not sound realistic if the shot was taken properly.

The bottom line is, this thread is certainly onto a hiding for nothing unless someone would like to do a scientifically executed back to back test.

It's this site's policy to encourage fair play all round - we don't encourage or tolerate abuse of others' choice of cameras or lenses if they aren't Olympus or similar and we certainly don't believe it is right to criticise Olympus gear for the sake of it.

If this thread develops into a pointless slanging match, appropriate action will be taken.

Ian
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
I dont think there is any "here we go again" just that the physics does not allow the cramming of 20 people onto a 4/3 sensor as well as spreading those over Fx..its just horses for courses ...I am sure that with a good 3-400mm lens the format is good for birding where pixels on image is the key ..for my commercial work it just would not be viable though I must admit that joe public knows nothing of image quality being satisfied with his mobile phone.
This is your opinion and this should be respected, to a degree. But its wording appears to condemn the E-M5 out of hand.

There are many examples of successful professional use of E-M5 and other Micro Four Third system cameras for work involving fine detail imaging.

Would a Nikon D810 be capable of producing quantifiably better results? Of course. But that does not mean an E-M5 would be useless. It all depends on the criteria of the job required.

Ian
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Re: Two camera test.

Here's a much better comparison.

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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Yes, as Ian pointed out, diffraction is your enemy at f8 on a u4/3 sensor. (It begs the question why the manufacturer provides smaller apertures knowing they're virtually unusable.)
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Cannot use that at a wedding ..need a tripod and they are moving ...
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Old 16th June 2017
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Re: Two camera test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistnbroke View Post
Cannot use that at a wedding ..need a tripod and they are moving ...
Being realistic, most wedding pics end up in a coffee table book, on a CD, etc., and viewed at best on an HDTV.

All those precious pixels get squashed down by the printers or the TV and very very few ever see the full res image...

Years ago the Canon G8 was compared with a MF and many of the professional reviewers couldn't tell the difference printed at 8x10

I have often produced pictures up to 20" x 16" for exhibitions and competitions and have never received an adverse comment.
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