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Olympus Pen-F The first Pen to integrate an electronic viewfinder

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  #16  
Old 17th April 2018
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

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Originally Posted by Growltiger View Post
Shutter shock is simply a vibration caused by the movement of the mechanical shutter. It causes blurred photos at slow shutter speeds. The anti-shock (diamond) mode 0s does not have side effects. Do exactly what pdk42 said:
"1) Set shutter to "0s anti-shock" (diamond symbol) and enable release-time lag = short (bottom of cogs menu C I think). This will 100% guarantee no potential for shutter shock."

[I don't happen to agree with his other suggestion "2) Turn "keep warm colors" to off (cogs menu G). This will stop interior shots in artificial light looking too orange."
The reason - I like interior shots to look a bit yellow, that is what we actually see in our houses at night. It is a matter of individual preference.]
When you say 'movement' I think we need to be careful with our words. All particles in nature (unless massless particles exist, and yes I'm familiar with E=MC^2) have momentum when in motion. The Earth is travelling in a straight line around the sun (mass bends space and time) and we are unaware of its motion. But if it came to a sudden stop it would be a different kettle of fish. It's similar with the shutter. Whilst in motion the sensor is unaware mechanically, but accelerate the mass both positively and negatively and the sensor becomes acutely aware. Impulse shock levels can be quite large, many 10's of g in fact, and can easily overcome the stabilised sensor.

Addendum: I almost forgot to mention the witch going by the name of resonance.
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  #17  
Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

OK - so a few notes about how the shutter works... bear with me....

In earlier Olympus m43 cameras (E-M5, E-PL5, E-PM2, E-P5 etc) the shutter operation had one mode and it worked like this:
  1. The shutter is open for live view until the user presses the shutter button
  2. The bottom curtain moves up to close and the sensor is cleared down ready for the exposure
  3. The bottom curtain moves down again to start the exposure
  4. The top curtain moves down to stop the exposure
  5. The top curtain opens again to re-start live view

The video below shows this (it's a Fuji camera, but the principle is the same).


Shutter shock happens because vibration can be induced in steps (2) and (3) - especially step (3). What happens is that "ringing" in the sensor assembly can be induced by the shutter movement and it takes time for this to die down. The ringing will vary according to the effective mass of the system - and by "system", I mean the mass of the camera, lens and its support (tripod, hands, ...). The end-result is complex and as a result some people say they never see shutter shock while others see it frequently.

The ringing usually dies down in about 20ms so it only effects certain shutter speeds - usually around 1/60 to 1/200s. Longer times mean that the ringing is a very small part of the exposure, shorter times mean that the exposure is much shorter than the vibration.

OK, so with that out of the way, how do the anti-shock modes fix it?

Well, before I get into that fix (the "0s anti-shock" feature), I'll just mention the older Olympus anti-shock settings (1/8s and longer) since it can be confusing due to Olympus calling two different technical strategies the same thing. This older, longer anti-shock is a delay introduced in between steps (1) and (2):
  1. The shutter is open for live view until the user presses the shutter button
    1/8s anti-shock and longer happens here
  2. The bottom curtain moves up to close and the sensor is cleared down ready for the exposure
  3. The bottom curtain moves down again to start the exposure
  4. The top curtain moves down to stop the exposure
  5. The top curtain opens again to re-start live view

It's really designed to stop user-induced camera shake and doesn't help with mechanical vibrations due to the shutter operation itself.

For older cameras (e.g. E-M5, E-PL5 etc), this is the only option available. Shutter shock can still be a lingering problem.

For slightly newer cameras (E-P5, E-M10, E-M10, E-M1), Olympus introduced a v.1 EFCS (Electronic First Curtain Shutter). I say v.1 since it's a strange implementation forced on them by the design of these shutters. Basically, these older shutters still have to go through the whole sequence indicated above (close, open, close, open), but what Olympus did was to introduce a short delay (about 20ms) in step (3):
  1. The shutter is open for live view until the user presses the shutter button
  2. The bottom curtain moves up to close and the sensor is cleared down ready for the exposure
  3. The bottom curtain moves down again to start the exposure
  4. Exposure start is delayed electronically by 20ms
  5. Exposure starts electronically (EFCS)
  6. The top curtain moves down to stop the exposure
  7. The top curtain opens again to re-start live view

So, in this case, Olympus use EFCS plus a small delay to allow the ringing to die down before exposure starts. It's a bit of a kludge, but it's very effective. It also means that "0s" is better labelled as "20ms", but there you have it!

On newer cameras (E-M5ii, E-M1ii, Pen-F etc), there's a new shutter which enables more control of the curtain movement and we have a v.2 EFCS implementation. In this case, there is no 20ms delay when the "0s" (EFCS) option is selected. The sequence is now:
  1. The shutter is open for live view until the user presses the shutter button
  2. Exposure starts electronically (EFCS)
  3. The top curtain moves down to stop the exposure
  4. The top curtain opens again to re-start live view

This is much simpler, and in fact you can hear the difference in operation quite clearly as you switch between normal and "0s" anti-shock.

AFAIK, there is no downside to EFCS so you may as well use it. There are reports on Sony cameras of EFCS causing some odd Bokeh effects, but it seems to be very subtle and I've never heard anyone complain about it on m43.

What about full electronic shutter? Well, stating the obvious there's no shutter movement:
  1. The shutter is open for live view until the user presses the shutter button
  2. Exposure starts electronically (EFCS)
  3. The sensor is read line-by-line after the desired exposure time

The downside is that the time taken to read the sensor line-by-line is material. Except on the E-M1ii, this process takes about 1/20s, irrespective of the shutter speed chosen. Each pixel will get the selected exposure time, but the total time to scan the sensor cannot be less than 1/20s. This introduces the well-known "jello" or "rolling shutter" effects. It can also cause banding in artificial light. The E-M1ii manages a much faster readout - about 1/60s. This reduces these effects, but they can still be seen in some circumstances.

Finally, a few words about "release time-lag = short". What's going on here is the manner in which the bottom curtain is held. With lag-time "normal", the curtain is held with a solenoid. The solenoid is activated to release the shutter. This means that no power is used to hold the shutter open, but there is some vibration introduced by operating the solenoid. With release time "short", the solenoid is held open and the shutter is held with an electro-magnet.

This has the benefit of allowing faster release, but it also means there is no vibration from the solenoid operation. However, it does mean that power is expended just to hold the shutter open. Its effect is smaller than the EFCS strategies discussed above, but careful testing by a user over on DPReview (using a proper test using an oscilloscope trace to measure it scientifically) shows that there is still residual ringing caused by the solenoid. Hence for the most protection from shutter shock you need "0s" anti-shock + release lag-time short.

Hope that helps!!
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  #18  
Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Wow - thanks so much - that's amazing. I was hoping someone might know of a link to this information, not actually write an article. I'll peruse in detail when I get chance.
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Thanks for the very clear explanation Paul. I am not aware of having suffered the effects of shutter shock, but it will be interesting to switch the option on and see if there is any difference.

John
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Thanks for the clear explanation Paul, I had noticed some occasional blurring on my E-M5 with speeds around 1/8 - 1/15 which I never had with my E-620, presumably because that had an optical finder. That clears up the reason!
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

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Originally Posted by RobEW View Post
Thanks. Does this setting in the menus (E-M1 shooting menu 2 / Anti-Shock / 0 seconds) make a difference only when the diamond shutter mode is selected (e.g. using the SCP)? I've always been using the rectangle shutter mode, described as "single".

(And if there are no side effects, I'm wondering why the rectangle mode exists, and is the default setting? Surely no-one wants shutter shock?)
Yes. Set it to 0 secs.

I doubt anyone knows why the non anti-shutter shock option still exists.
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Paul, thank you for that excellent explanation.
I do have a question. You say "Finally, a few words about "release time-lag = short". What's going on here is the manner in which the bottom curtain is held."
But with the Pen-F the shutter sequence you show doesn't mention the bottom curtain.

Perhaps the explanation is that the Pen-F is v1 EFCS?
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Paul
I have been trying to fully understand the full sequence of events during ProCapture Low, and also just simple Sequential Low (mechanical and electronic shutter), in both cases when using C-AF.

Here is a thread about it on M43, my message #10 shows the puzzle that I am trying to solve. https://www.mu-43.com/threads/pro-ca...al-lens.97983/
So I want to understand when the aperture opens and closes, when it focuses, and when the (shutter operates.
Specifically, does the aperture open and close for every photo taken (so that it can focus fully open)?
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Old 17th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Not sure if this is the right place to ask this question but I am going away for the weekend and would really like to take a lightweight short telephoto plus the brand new Pen with me. The only lightweight tele I have is a Canon 100mm FD f2.8 which would be fine (I have the adaptor) but so far I have not managed to get focus peaking working on this legacy lens. I have no problem using peaking on a native mFT lens so does anyone know the magic ingredient that would work on a legacy lens?

Many thanks in advance
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  #25  
Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Quote:
Originally Posted by Growltiger View Post
Paul, thank you for that excellent explanation.
I do have a question. You say "Finally, a few words about "release time-lag = short". What's going on here is the manner in which the bottom curtain is held."
But with the Pen-F the shutter sequence you show doesn't mention the bottom curtain.

Perhaps the explanation is that the Pen-F is v1 EFCS?
Pen F is definitely v.2 EFCS. I may have the top/bottom curtain explanation the wrong way around. The principle is correct though.
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  #26  
Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Quote:
Originally Posted by Growltiger View Post
Paul
I have been trying to fully understand the full sequence of events during ProCapture Low, and also just simple Sequential Low (mechanical and electronic shutter), in both cases when using C-AF.

Here is a thread about it on M43, my message #10 shows the puzzle that I am trying to solve. https://www.mu-43.com/threads/pro-ca...al-lens.97983/
So I want to understand when the aperture opens and closes, when it focuses, and when the (shutter operates.
Specifically, does the aperture open and close for every photo taken (so that it can focus fully open)?
M43 cameras always focus wide open. If you're shooting stopped down then the aperture will be opening and closing for every shot. That's why the continuous frame rate drops with some older lenses (e.g. the Panasonic 100-300).
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  #27  
Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

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Originally Posted by RogerMac View Post
Not sure if this is the right place to ask this question but I am going away for the weekend and would really like to take a lightweight short telephoto plus the brand new Pen with me. The only lightweight tele I have is a Canon 100mm FD f2.8 which would be fine (I have the adaptor) but so far I have not managed to get focus peaking working on this legacy lens. I have no problem using peaking on a native mFT lens so does anyone know the magic ingredient that would work on a legacy lens?

Many thanks in advance
You need to assign focus peeking to a button to turn it on and off.
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  #28  
Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

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Originally Posted by pdk42 View Post
Pen F is definitely v.2 EFCS. I may have the top/bottom curtain explanation the wrong way around. The principle is correct though.
But the E-M1 II, which as you say sounds different, and is v2 EFCS, doesn't have the Release lag-time setting at all.
Perhaps this is just because it has a different shutter?
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Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdk42 View Post
M43 cameras always focus wide open. If you're shooting stopped down then the aperture will be opening and closing for every shot. That's why the continuous frame rate drops with some older lenses (e.g. the Panasonic 100-300).
So when doing ProCapture with C-AF the aperture is definitely opening and closing 18 times a second? I can't see it doing that but perhaps the eye can't see the movement.
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Old 18th April 2018
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Re: About to buy a Pen-F

Quote:
Originally Posted by Growltiger View Post
But the E-M1 II, which as you say sounds different, and is v2 EFCS, doesn't have the Release lag-time setting at all.
Perhaps this is just because it has a different shutter?
Yes, the E-M1ii has a different shutter. It can do mechanical shutter at 15fps.
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