Olympus UK E-System User Group
Olympus UK E-System User Group

Join our unique resource for Olympus Four Thirds E-System DSLR and Pen and OM-D Micro Four Thirds photographers. Show your images via our free e-group photo gallery. Please read the e-group.uk.net forum terms and conditions before posting for the first time. Above all, welcome!


Go Back   Olympus UK E-System User Group > Cameras, lenses and system accessories > Nostalgia Nexus - early and pre-digital discussion

Nostalgia Nexus - early and pre-digital discussion Want to discuss the really early days of digital and even film - here is the place for you.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #91  
Old 28th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Ah yes, Box 14 Hemel Hempstead - what a good memory you have. I've also read about the environmental issues, but that aside I doubt there's a business model to make the revival viable. RIP
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 28th April 2017
Naughty Nigel's Avatar
Naughty Nigel Naughty Nigel is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Land of the Prince Bishops
Posts: 8,632
Thanks: 355
Thanked 490 Times in 416 Posts
Likes: 2,881
Liked 2,056 Times in 1,361 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
Ah yes, Box 14 Hemel Hempstead - what a good memory you have. I've also read about the environmental issues, but that aside I doubt there's a business model to make the revival viable. RIP
With good timing you could post the films off to Box 14 before traveling home from holiday, and they would be waiting on the doormat when you got there.

Who needs digital?
__________________
---------------

Naughty Nigel


Difficult is worth doing
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 28th April 2017
David M's Avatar
David M David M is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: A Brit now living in Ontario, Canada.
Posts: 6,601
Thanks: 39
Thanked 678 Times in 640 Posts
Likes: 254
Liked 1,294 Times in 790 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
With good timing you could post the films off to Box 14 before traveling home from holiday, and they would be waiting on the doormat when you got there.

Who needs digital?
Or you return from an overseas trip to send 40 rolls to Box 14 only for Kodak to damage the eighteenth or nineteenth frame on every roll.

I've always been of the opinion that Velvia was partly responsible for the demise of Kodachrome. After the launch of Velvia a lot of editors were looking for the Velvia colour palette.
__________________
It's the image that's important, not the tools used to make it.

The Grumpy Snapper blog or follow me on Instagram.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 28th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

I've done that, posted from Greece, no less, and transperencies arrived on the doormat before me.

Who needs digital indeed, certainly not if we could persuade Kodak.

I'm being honest I'm looking for a way to justify the MP, but hesitation allows me to prepare my story... to the wife. I'm wondering if she would see the difference between my M240 and the MP if they only accompanied us one at a time. Perhaps I could tell her the film advance is some sort of grip I've added for stability.
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 28th April 2017
Naughty Nigel's Avatar
Naughty Nigel Naughty Nigel is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Land of the Prince Bishops
Posts: 8,632
Thanks: 355
Thanked 490 Times in 416 Posts
Likes: 2,881
Liked 2,056 Times in 1,361 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
I'm being honest I'm looking for a way to justify the MP, but hesitation allows me to prepare my story... to the wife. I'm wondering if she would see the difference between my M240 and the MP if they only accompanied us one at a time. Perhaps I could tell her the film advance is some sort of grip I've added for stability.
We could do with workshops on this subject. Sneaking new camera equipment into the house is not so difficult, but Management has eyes like a hawk when I get it out to use it.

My pleas of 'oh, I've had that one for ages' simply don't wash.

(Of course it's different when she goes clothes shopping with our daughter, although I suppose the costs are an order of magnitude different too.)
__________________
---------------

Naughty Nigel


Difficult is worth doing
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 28th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Brilliant Nigel... like a Dragan Dens' moment! Could charge attendees say 5% or 10% of their intended purchase for a 1/2 day seminar on * 'how to pull the wool over your misses'. *

Definitely worth a new thread based on the same title *...*
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 29th April 2017
Simon Bee's Avatar
Simon Bee Simon Bee is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Bridgend, South Wales
Posts: 1,847
Thanks: 138
Thanked 208 Times in 177 Posts
Likes: 414
Liked 284 Times in 180 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post

I'm being honest I'm looking for a way to justify the MP,
Steve,

I knew you still had that 'itch to scratch'

If you haven't seen it, Red Dot currently have a nice black one for 2k ...

....... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...aint-body.html

or you could go for the silver 'a-la-carte' that keeps 'calling' to me every few days ( must resist, honestly I must, I don't need it but what has 'need' got to do with it ) .........

..... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...ome-boxed.html

or really push the boat out and get the MP-3 LHSA ......
....... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...cavit-lhsa.htm




Simon
__________________
One should take the "PLANK" out of one's own eye before trying to take a "splinter" out of someone else's
Reply With Quote
The Following User Liked This Post:
Ricoh (29th April 2017)
  #98  
Old 29th April 2017
cariadus's Avatar
cariadus cariadus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Barry, Vale of Glamorgan
Posts: 1,350
Thanks: 10
Thanked 140 Times in 129 Posts
Likes: 10
Liked 123 Times in 66 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Although flatbeds are never going to match dedicated film scanners for quality, the Epson Perfection series, 4990, V500, V700, V800 etc, probably come pretty close. I'm happy with my 4990 and it will scan up to 10x8. One of the most sought after 35mm scanners is the Pakon F-135. There's even a Facebook Group dedicated to it.

Kodak haven't ruled out bringing Kodachrome back:
https://fstoppers.com/film/kodachrom...ld-help-161128
Whether it actually happens is another question though.

And did you know that it is possible to get Kodachrome developed now? Kelly-Shane Fuller in the US has been considering offering a commercial service to develop Kodachrome.
https://www.filmshooterscollective.c...ne-fuller-4-21
Note that the photos in that article are from a year ago, he's got a lot better at it since.
__________________
Roger

E-M5, 20mm/1.7, 45mm/1.8
OM-1N, OM-10, OM-4ti, 24mm/2.8, 50mm/1.8, 85mm/2, Tamron 70-210mm/3.5
cariadus.com | flickr | tumblr
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to cariadus For This Useful Post:
Ricoh (29th April 2017)
The Following User Liked This Post:
Ricoh (29th April 2017)
  #99  
Old 29th April 2017
cariadus's Avatar
cariadus cariadus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Barry, Vale of Glamorgan
Posts: 1,350
Thanks: 10
Thanked 140 Times in 129 Posts
Likes: 10
Liked 123 Times in 66 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by David M View Post
I've always been of the opinion that Velvia was partly responsible for the demise of Kodachrome. After the launch of Velvia a lot of editors were looking for the Velvia colour palette.
You may well be right about that. Whilst it's easy to get swept up in the nostalgia for Kodachrome the simple truth is that Velvia was a better choice for many photograhers, not least because of the standard E6 processing. Personally I don't really care too much whether they bring Kodachrome back, just so long as Fuji keeps making Velvia.

Those yellow boxes were pretty special, though, weren't they?

__________________
Roger

E-M5, 20mm/1.7, 45mm/1.8
OM-1N, OM-10, OM-4ti, 24mm/2.8, 50mm/1.8, 85mm/2, Tamron 70-210mm/3.5
cariadus.com | flickr | tumblr
Reply With Quote
The Following Users Liked This Post:
drmarkf (29th April 2017), Ricoh (29th April 2017)
  #100  
Old 29th April 2017
David M's Avatar
David M David M is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: A Brit now living in Ontario, Canada.
Posts: 6,601
Thanks: 39
Thanked 678 Times in 640 Posts
Likes: 254
Liked 1,294 Times in 790 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Actually there was one very good reason to prefer Kodachrome over Velvia, it was far more resistant to the colours changing/fading when the trannies sat on an editors light table for days.
__________________
It's the image that's important, not the tools used to make it.

The Grumpy Snapper blog or follow me on Instagram.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Liked This Post:
Naughty Nigel (30th April 2017)
  #101  
Old 29th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Bee View Post
Steve,

I knew you still had that 'itch to scratch'

If you haven't seen it, Red Dot currently have a nice black one for 2k ...

....... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...aint-body.html

or you could go for the silver 'a-la-carte' that keeps 'calling' to me every few days ( must resist, honestly I must, I don't need it but what has 'need' got to do with it ) .........

..... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...ome-boxed.html

or really push the boat out and get the MP-3 LHSA ......
....... http://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/m-bod...cavit-lhsa.htm




Simon
Or this: http://www.photospecialist.co.uk/lei...nish#group6424 but I'm not sure about guarantee rights for an import. But who needs a guarantee for a Mechanical Perfection camera ?

And yet another: https://www.leicastoremanchester.com...int-a-la-carte in Black Lizard skin - lovely!!
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 29th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by David M View Post
Actually there was one very good reason to prefer Kodachrome over Velvia, it was far more resistant to the colours changing/fading when the trannies sat on an editors light table for days.
This thought has caused me to consider how long digital files will survive. What happens when the inevitable happens and hard drive interfaces change, operating systems no longer supporting the older interface etc etc?
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 30th April 2017
Naughty Nigel's Avatar
Naughty Nigel Naughty Nigel is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Land of the Prince Bishops
Posts: 8,632
Thanks: 355
Thanked 490 Times in 416 Posts
Likes: 2,881
Liked 2,056 Times in 1,361 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoh View Post
This thought has caused me to consider how long digital files will survive. What happens when the inevitable happens and hard drive interfaces change, operating systems no longer supporting the older interface etc etc?
All digital photographic images are bitmaps at the end of the day, so there is no reason why the image formats that we use today shouldn't still be readable in years to come.

Certainly the popular file formats (TIFF, JPG, etc.) seem to have stood the test of time remarkably well so far, and with JPG being the default image format used by web browsers so there is no reason why they should ever go out of date.

All of these images are cross-platform compatible, and in any case it is the apps rather than the OS's that determine compatibility.

The only likely change is that the 16 MP images we consider to be 'high resolution' today will be overshadowed by much higher resolution images tomorrow; just as 5 MP now seems small.

However, longevity of the files themselves is an issue, as hard drives don't have the best archival properties. An array of three or more disks is safer, as the array can rebuild itself should any one of the disks fail. Cloud backup is a wise precaution, but that too could fail under some circumstances, and we as individuals have little say in what happens to our data once uploaded.

CD's and particularly DVD's are a very dangerous place to store important files as they are so easily damaged and rendered unusable. Even an hour or so in the sun could wipe them clean!

My personal choice is LTO tape, which has excellent archival properties if the tapes are stored properly, and kept well away form mobile phones! The tapes themselves are cheap, (about 25 for a 6 TB tape), and offer much better read/write accuracy than hard drives, but the hardware is expensive.
__________________
---------------

Naughty Nigel


Difficult is worth doing
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 30th April 2017
David M's Avatar
David M David M is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: A Brit now living in Ontario, Canada.
Posts: 6,601
Thanks: 39
Thanked 678 Times in 640 Posts
Likes: 254
Liked 1,294 Times in 790 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

And don't forget to keep a backup off site.
__________________
It's the image that's important, not the tools used to make it.

The Grumpy Snapper blog or follow me on Instagram.
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 30th April 2017
Ricoh Ricoh is offline
Full member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 5,530
Thanks: 580
Thanked 392 Times in 350 Posts
Likes: 765
Liked 1,775 Times in 1,066 Posts
Re: The lure of the uncomplicated camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Naughty Nigel View Post
All digital photographic images are bitmaps at the end of the day, so there is no reason why the image formats that we use today shouldn't still be readable in years to come.

Certainly the popular file formats (TIFF, JPG, etc.) seem to have stood the test of time remarkably well so far, and with JPG being the default image format used by web browsers so there is no reason why they should ever go out of date.

All of these images are cross-platform compatible, and in any case it is the apps rather than the OS's that determine compatibility.

The only likely change is that the 16 MP images we consider to be 'high resolution' today will be overshadowed by much higher resolution images tomorrow; just as 5 MP now seems small.

However, longevity of the files themselves is an issue, as hard drives don't have the best archival properties. An array of three or more disks is safer, as the array can rebuild itself should any one of the disks fail. Cloud backup is a wise precaution, but that too could fail under some circumstances, and we as individuals have little say in what happens to our data once uploaded.

CD's and particularly DVD's are a very dangerous place to store important files as they are so easily damaged and rendered unusable. Even an hour or so in the sun could wipe them clean!

My personal choice is LTO tape, which has excellent archival properties if the tapes are stored properly, and kept well away form mobile phones! The tapes themselves are cheap, (about 25 for a 6 TB tape), and offer much better read/write accuracy than hard drives, but the hardware is expensive.
Of course film isn't immune either, especially when one's wife throws the prints and negatives away - one of those decluttering events when I had my mind on other things and photography was little more than a latent interest.
__________________
Steve

on flickr
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
WARNING: E-M1 Camera body eyelet has come away from camera body! catkins Olympus OM-D E-M1 45 20th January 2019 05:14 PM
Oly Digital Camera Updater - 2.0 Saves camera settings! Ross the fiddler Software 6 4th November 2016 10:29 AM
HELP! What new camera to buy ? Taz The lounge 9 4th December 2014 06:07 PM
New camera Ijay37 Olympus Pen E-P1 1 20th October 2009 12:46 PM
Camera Society or Camera Club? Ellie The lounge 4 13th August 2008 04:04 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:34 PM.


The Write Technology Ltd, 2007-2018, All rights reservedAd Management plugin by RedTyger