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Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 11:19 AM
I think I have heard it all now.

Apparently they are all stressed out by having to check their social media accounts every ten seconds, exercising too much or too little, eating the wrong amounts of food, stressing about buying the latest gizmos, stressing about not dating, about keeping up with everyone else and not saving whilst a suffering a non-stop yearning for a 'feeling of achievement'.

BBC Report - ĎWe all have millennial burnoutí (https://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/article/245d1d9f-17f6-483e-81d2-3979d69432c6)

A first I thought it was a pi55take but it seems to be real. :rolleyes:

Maybe I am missing something but I would have thought there was a very easy answer to most, if not all of their woes.

TimP
8th March 2019, 11:31 AM
Pathetic the lot of ‘em. Can we say ‘pathetic’ or is it no longer acceptable? Apologies if anyone needs to have a safe place to retreat to simply for me saying that.
I don’t think ‘snowflake’ is acceptable now either.
A bit like the word ‘coloured’ now.

Tram
8th March 2019, 11:39 AM
No worse than outraged Gammons and the entitled "paid in all my life" old flag wavers.

Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 11:43 AM
A bit like the word Ďcolouredí now.

That was utterly ridiculous.

What is the difference between 'a coloured lady' and 'a lady of colour' apart from the questionable grammar in the second example?

Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 11:45 AM
No worse than outraged Gammons and the entitled "paid in all my life" old flag wavers.

Since when did having six social media accounts and checking them all every ten seconds become compulsory? :(

We really do need a 'shaking my head' smiley on this forum. *yes

Tram
8th March 2019, 11:54 AM
Since when did having six social media accounts and checking them all every ten seconds become compulsory? :(

We really do need a 'shaking my head' smiley on this forum. *yes

Bit like keep checking posts and moaning on forums all day then?

Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 12:08 PM
Bit like keep checking posts and moaning on forums all day then?

I don't think 8,520 posts over a period of 11 years counts as 'moaning on forums all day'.

By my reckoning that works out at 2.1 posts per day.

In reality there have been long periods (weeks rather than seconds) when I have not visited the forum at all.

Tram
8th March 2019, 12:12 PM
I don't think 8,520 posts over a period of 11 years counts as 'moaning on forums all day'.

By my reckoning that works out at 2.1 posts per day.

In reality there have been long periods (weeks rather than seconds) when I have not visited the forum at all.

Checked and replied to this one pretty quick though, soon be over your quota at this rate.

TimP
8th March 2019, 03:21 PM
Checked and replied to this one pretty quick though, soon be over your quota at this rate.

Someone seems very defensive, could you perhaps be a bit snowflakey yourself?

I donít mind being in the Ďpaid in for 45 yearsí brigade either.

Tram
8th March 2019, 04:50 PM
Someone seems very defensive, could you perhaps be a bit snowflakey yourself?

I don’t mind being in the ‘paid in for 45 years’ brigade either.

Not at all, just fed up with all youngsters being branded as useless.
Usually by miserable old sods who display similar traits, but won't admit it
How about they have to keep getting the latest phone. Substitute camera for phone and that applies to a good few on here.
Older generation have left a right pile of dung for our kids, the latest being leaving the EU.

They have pressure piled on in school and by parents, peer pressure on social media too doesn't help.
Not sure why anyone here who has done ok from life has to post such things, condescending at best and downright hateful at worst.

Must say out of the few photography sites I have posted on this has some of the nastiest members.
Even witnessed misogyny here the other day, no excuse for that sort of behaviour at all.
"I'd love to see a picture of your rack, Janet."
Do you think this sort of comment is nice and would you like your wife/daughter to be subjected to it?
Worse of all that was from an administrator, what a poor example or maybe that just sets the tone

Otto
8th March 2019, 05:10 PM
I've just been chatting in the pub to a 21yo Australian lad who is travelling over here, solo, working his passage and learning about his English and Norwegian ancestors. A very articulate and interesting young man with a remarkably mature world view, although I did have to put him right about Fox News :). I get as p*ssed off with people my age deriding the young as a useless waste of space as I did when I was his age. This particular lad is travelling around Scandinavia and the UK with a 30kg backpack and was quite happy to walk from Scarborough to Whitby carrying it. Snowflake? I don't think so. And you can try talking to any of the Duke of Edinburgh's Award participants we get around here too and you won't find them looking at their "six social media accounts every ten seconds" either. That sort of attitude to young people really winds me up.

Gate Keeper
8th March 2019, 09:54 PM
I don't think 8,520 posts over a period of 11 years counts as 'moaning on forums all day'.

By my reckoning that works out at 2.1 posts per day.

In reality there have been long periods (weeks rather than seconds) when I have not visited the forum at all.

Lightweight! :D :D

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pdk42
8th March 2019, 10:41 PM
Whinging about nothing and feeling the world is against you is not restricted to youngsters. There was a long piece on PM tonight (Fri 8th Mar) a little before the 6pm news about how women are more likely to suffer from depression than men. Fair enough, perhaps - but it was dominated by an interview with Justine Roberts, the founder of Mumsnet, and some journalist, which was so man-hating it was unbelievable. It was just one long whinge-fest about how bad it is for women.

How women now work more but still have child-bearing duties, how men don't pull their weight in the home, how much stress there is to look good ("be curated") and bring up a family, how women need to endure so much more than men, how men only do the interesting chores with children (like parents' evenings and school plays), how women just take on more than men because they have to, how they have to look after their own parents as well as their children, how women can't decompress by going to the pub like men can, how woman are the ones who always accommodate over conflict and give in, ... it went on and on. Never in their ramblings did they mention that perhaps many of those things are conscious choices that the individuals themselves made.

Honestly, it was if men just hang around having a whale of a time while the woman do all the work and in doing so end up clinically depressed.

Now, I'm a pretty emancipated sort of guy and am hugely positive about what woman can and should be able to do in their lives - but really, this piece just grated. In any case, why do men die younger?

Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 10:51 PM
Not at all, just fed up with all youngsters being branded as useless.
Usually by miserable old sods who display similar traits, but won't admit it
How about they have to keep getting the latest phone. Substitute camera for phone and that applies to a good few on here.
Older generation have left a right pile of dung for our kids, the latest being leaving the EU.

They have pressure piled on in school and by parents, peer pressure on social media too doesn't help.
Not sure why anyone here who has done ok from life has to post such things, condescending at best and downright hateful at worst.

Must say out of the few photography sites I have posted on this has some of the nastiest members.
Even witnessed misogyny here the other day, no excuse for that sort of behaviour at all.
"I'd love to see a picture of your rack, Janet."
Do you think this sort of comment is nice and would you like your wife/daughter to be subjected to it?
Worse of all that was from an administrator, what a poor example or maybe that just sets the tone

I would submit that you are completely missing the point. I also wonder whether you read and digested the contents of all of the essays in the linked article?

Nobody has branded anyone as 'stupid' that I can see.

The point you are missing is that nearly all of the matters being complained about in the essays were either self-inflicted, or were inflicted by others of similar age; not by grumpy old gits on photography forums.

Nobody is forced to have a social media account, and certainly not six of them. Nobody is forced to have a smartphone or to upgrade it every six weeks. Nobody who thinks for themselves needs to be sucked in and constantly fleeced by Ämulti-trillion American businesses.

I accept that school life and examinations can be stressful, but I don't remember O and A-Level exams being particularly easy 45 years ago either. On the flip side there are opportunities available now that simply didn't exist twenty years ago.

I also accept that older generations have left a hell of a mess behind them including horrendous environmental damage and huge amounts of national debt; but that is nothing new. When I was born rationing had not long stopped, there were widespread shortages of basic materials and large bomb sites in the centres of many towns and cities. Life was also pretty hard for parents. My own parents had been bombed out of their home when my brother and sister were young, and my mother billeted away in Loughborough away from the worst of the bombing.

I would suggest that these conditions were rather more challenging for ordinary people than Brexit.

I don't believe for one minute that life is easy for young people. It never was. Our own children are now young adults so we have seen first hand what they have to contend with; but in most cases the lives of young people are no more difficult than those of previous generations; it is their totally unrealistic expectations of life that are the problem.

Naughty Nigel
8th March 2019, 11:14 PM
There was a long piece on PM tonight (Fri 8th Mar) a little before the 6pm news about how women are more likely to suffer from depression than men. Fair enough, perhaps - but it was dominated by an interview with Justine Roberts, the founder of Mumsnet, and some journalist, which was so man-hating it was unbelievable. It was just one long whinge-fest about how bad it is for women.

How women now work more but still have child-bearing duties, how men don't pull their weight in the home, how much stress there is to look good ("be curated") and bring up a family, how women need to endure so much more than men, how men only do the interesting chores with children (like parents' evenings and school plays), how women just take on more than men because they have to, how they have to look after their own parents as well as their children, how women can't decompress by going to the pub like men can, how woman are the ones who always accommodate over conflict and give in, ... it went on and on.

Honestly, it was if men just hang around having a whale of a time while the woman do all the work and in doing so end up clinically depressed.



Isn't this just an example of the unrealistic expectations that I was talking about?

Laura (29) said "I was working long hours, going out a lot, and stressing about everything: day-to-day work-life, after-work plans, exercising too much or too little, eating the wrong amount, travel, rent, the fact I wasnít saving, dating, and so on."

The long hours, travel and rent I get, but the others are self inflicted.

Rather than therapy I cannot help but feel that a reality check might be more helpful.

pdk42
8th March 2019, 11:20 PM
Isn't this just an example of the unrealistic expectations that I was talking about?

Laura (29) said "I was working long hours, going out a lot, and stressing about everything: day-to-day work-life, after-work plans, exercising too much or too little, eating the wrong amount, travel, rent, the fact I wasnít saving, dating, and so on."

The long hours, travel and rent I get, but the others are self inflicted.

Rather than therapy I cannot help but feel that a reality check might be more helpful.

Yes, precisely.

Gate Keeper
9th March 2019, 07:30 AM
Isn't this just an example of the unrealistic expectations that I was talking about?

Laura (29) said "I was working long hours, going out a lot, and stressing about everything: day-to-day work-life, after-work plans, exercising too much or too little, eating the wrong amount, travel, rent, the fact I wasnít saving, dating, and so on."

The long hours, travel and rent I get, but the others are self inflicted.

Rather than therapy I cannot help but feel that a reality check might be more helpful.

Laura - "At times, I was eating and drinking so much I wondered if I had an alcohol problem or eating disorder. But, last year, I started seeing a therapist, and she thinks I was just using those things to help me cope with the burnout and anxiety I was feeling."

Hold one, it was therapy that pointed out what the reality of Laura's issues were and I suspect, therapy offered up coping strategies. It certainly would have involved a reality check.

Harold Gough
9th March 2019, 09:53 AM
In any case, why do men die younger?

Is that all men or just the married ones?

Harold

Otto
9th March 2019, 10:04 AM
The difference today in my view is the relentless advertising wherever you go insisting that you must have x, y or z to be fulfilled and happy. That did not exist to the extent it does now when I was growing up in the 50s and 60s. League tables, endless comparisons and the like create more pressure, not to mention having to watch what you say and/or write all the time in case somebody somewhere takes offence. I don't think you can equate what young people have to contend with to the pressures and difficulties we had back then. Anxiety and depression are almost endemic among young people, and suicide is the biggest cause of death among young men in particular. Let's also not forget that kids are brought up wrapped in cotton wool so they never really learn about risk and how to cope with it. Is it any wonder they get stressed?

Jax
9th March 2019, 10:24 AM
Even witnessed misogyny here the other day, no excuse for that sort of behaviour at all.
"I'd love to see a picture of your rack, Janet."
Do you think this sort of comment is nice and would you like your wife/daughter to be subjected to it?
Worse of all that was from an administrator, what a poor example or maybe that just sets the tone

That's the only sensible and valid comment you have made so far and one that should be applauded. You're correct, there is no excuse.

Jax

pdk42
9th March 2019, 10:51 AM
Even witnessed misogyny here the other day, no excuse for that sort of behaviour at all.
"I'd love to see a picture of your rack, Janet."
Do you think this sort of comment is nice and would you like your wife/daughter to be subjected to it?
Worse of all that was from an administrator, what a poor example or maybe that just sets the tone
To be fair to John, he apologised quickly and admitted that his behaviour was ladish and unacceptable. We all make mistakes sometimes - what matters is that we admit and atone for them.

John is a more than decent chap and I think we should look at his comment as a temporary aberration.

Gate Keeper
9th March 2019, 11:06 AM
To be fair to John, he apologised quickly and admitted that his behaviour was ladish and unacceptable. We all make mistakes sometimes - what matters is that we admit and atone for them.

John is a more than decent chap and I think we should look at his comment as a temporary aberration.

I missed the comment and I agree with all of your points. Its easy sometimes to forget where we are and this is a family forum. He apologised and that should be the end of the matter.

MJ224
9th March 2019, 11:10 AM
I have to admit my thoughts went along the lines of Zuiko, as is my sense of humour....:confused:

But as Paul has already said, Zuiko quickly retracted his comment, and apologised. The lady in question has said there was no offence taken. I think we are (mostly) of an age where we seek humour, sometimes a tad far perhaps. But it is not the end of the world, and shall we just get on with what's left of our lives...…………...*chr

Mountains out of molehills comes to mind...……….

Harold Gough
9th March 2019, 11:26 AM
If making a remark is considered offensive, is it less so to quote it?

Harold:confused:

Gate Keeper
9th March 2019, 12:25 PM
I have to admit my thoughts went along the lines of Zuiko, as is my sense of humour....:confused:

But as Paul has already said, Zuiko quickly retracted his comment, and apologised. The lady in question has said there was no offence taken. I think we are (mostly) of an age where we seek humour, sometimes a tad far perhaps. But it is not the end of the world, and shall we just get on with what's left of our lives...ÖÖÖÖ...*chr

Mountains out of molehills comes to mind...ÖÖÖ.

Well said Mark and having met with you and spoken with on the phone, your humour and one liners is valued, your a natural :D Without further ado, lets get back to the thread and talk about burnt out ;)

Harold Gough
9th March 2019, 12:42 PM
Having looked back at the original link:

Re: feeling guilty about relaxing and "forcing myself to relax", I can guarantee that neither circumstance will bring any relaxation.

Harold

Rebecca
9th March 2019, 12:49 PM
So Guys, because the comment in question was posted by a "more than decent chap" who shortly after made a hand wringing apology, sexist comments are acceptable in this forum ? :confused:

The fact is if the same comment had been made in real life by someone in "Authority", it would have resulted in demands for resignation, despite the stated apology.

Personally, I would have not been offended by the comment as I hear worse every day, a consequence of being female and working in an environment populated mainly by male management. This however does not mean that I relish such comments. On the other hand, I have to agree with Tram that sexist, mysogynistic comments are unacceptable in forums especially when posted by a Mod.

I also can't help wondering if the subsequent supportive posts would have been made if the OP had not been a member of the Admin Team.

I guess it's just a fact of life wherever "decent chaps" congregate, even those of an old age that should know better, this sort of attitude toward females will always exist.

Anyway, it's my day off, the sun is actually shining, so I just need to decide whether to wash the car or have a stroll in the countryside and take some photos. I have a feeling the car wash will win. :)


Rebecca

MJ224
9th March 2019, 12:59 PM
H'mmm the mountain continues to grow. Anyone see the film The Englishman Who Went Up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain

Set in Wales not too many miles from me...ÖÖ...*chr

(All about surveyors)

Harold Gough
9th March 2019, 01:10 PM
The fact is if the same comment had been made in real life...

An interesting choice of words, in the context of this thread.

Harold

Zuiko
9th March 2019, 01:48 PM
I accept that my comment continues to cause concern on this forum and I regret making it - not because of any affect it is having on me but simply because in hindsight it was ill-judged, inappropriate and has caused genuine offense to my fellow members. I would advise anyone who thinks action should be taken against me to report the post in question to the other mods and I will step down if necessary. This can be done by using the report button at the top of the original post or by sending a PM to Ian.

Naughty Nigel
9th March 2019, 01:54 PM
Whilst on the subject, I would argue that the term 'Gammon' is racist, ageist and sexist; and is therefore offensive. I therefore wonder whether the comment concerned will also be retracted?

Darkroom
9th March 2019, 02:26 PM
Whilst on the subject, I would argue that the term 'Gammon' is racist, ageist and therefore offensive. I therefore wonder whether the comment concerned will also be retracted?

Maybe I need to get out more but the only Gammon I've ever encountered goes great with a couple of free range eggs and a slice of pineapple. I don't even know what it means in the context Tram used it.

Ok Ok, I do need to get out more, I admit it :)

Darkroom

Naughty Nigel
9th March 2019, 02:53 PM
If you look in up you will find that the term is generally considered racist, ageist and sexist as it refers specifically to older white males with a certain complexion.

Given the context in which the comment was made, and the supporting commentary I find this rather ironic.

Naughty Nigel
9th March 2019, 03:02 PM
I accept that my comment continues to cause concern on this forum and I regret making it - not because of any affect it is having on me but simply because in hindsight it was ill-judged, inappropriate and has caused genuine offense to my fellow members. I would advise anyone who thinks action should be taken against me to report the post in question to the other mods and I will step down if necessary. This can be done by using the report button at the top of the original post or by sending a PM to Ian.


Thank you John, but I think you should stay.

Otto
9th March 2019, 03:03 PM
O for goodness' sake everyone, lighten up a bit. Taking offence seems almost to be a profession with some people these days (and I mean that in general terms). As I alluded earlier, is it surprising that anxiety is becoming so commonplace when you have to be so careful about what you say even in jest. As it happens I had never heard the expression that has caused all the fuss here before and had to look it up!

It wasn't used in a derogatory or demeaning manner, just a bit of fun. But as Basil Fawlty once said (I think) "ah yes, fun. I remember that".

Darkroom
9th March 2019, 03:19 PM
If you look in up you will find that the term is generally considered racist, ageist and sexist as it refers specifically to older white males with a certain complexion.

Given the context in which the comment was made, and the supporting commentary I find this rather ironic.

Thanks Nigel, I do tend to forget that Mr Google knows everything. Now I'm more educated on the subject of gammon, I have to agree with your comment unreservedly but I'm not surprised as the poster seems to delight in making similar insults.

Darkroom

Darkroom
9th March 2019, 03:22 PM
As it happens I had never heard the expression that has caused all the fuss here before and had to look it up!

It seems we both maybe need to get out more :D

Darkroom

Harold Gough
9th March 2019, 03:33 PM
If you look in up you will find that the term is generally considered racist, ageist and sexist as it refers specifically to older white males with a certain complexion.

Given the context in which the comment was made, and the supporting commentary I find this rather ironic.

Something else for us to beef about! :D

Harold

Otto
9th March 2019, 03:59 PM
Thanks Nigel, I do tend to forget that Mr Google knows everything.


I find the Urban Dictionary (https://www.urbandictionary.com/) more use when it comes to words and phrases that have obscure alternative meanings that I may not have been previously aware of :).

DerekW
9th March 2019, 04:21 PM
Just do not go there if you are a sensitive flower or in a unlit room

Jim Ford
9th March 2019, 09:23 PM
Gosh this thread has become very strange! Perhaps the Brexit thread should be reopened so all the 'cut and thrust' can be carried out there! *yes

Jim

pdk42
9th March 2019, 09:37 PM
I accept that my comment continues to cause concern on this forum and I regret making it - not because of any affect it is having on me but simply because in hindsight it was ill-judged, inappropriate and has caused genuine offense to my fellow members. I would advise anyone who thinks action should be taken against me to report the post in question to the other mods and I will step down if necessary. This can be done by using the report button at the top of the original post or by sending a PM to Ian.
I for one won't be sending any such reports. I think we all need to lighten up here. Maybe since tomorrow is Sunday we should all go out and take some photographs in the fresh air.

Keith-369
9th March 2019, 09:41 PM
The difference today in my view is the relentless advertising wherever you go insisting that you must have x, y or z to be fulfilled and happy. That did not exist to the extent it does now when I was growing up in the 50s and 60s. League tables, endless comparisons and the like create more pressure, not to mention having to watch what you say and/or write all the time in case somebody somewhere takes offence. I don't think you can equate what young people have to contend with to the pressures and difficulties we had back then. Anxiety and depression are almost endemic among young people, and suicide is the biggest cause of death among young men in particular. Let's also not forget that kids are brought up wrapped in cotton wool so they never really learn about risk and how to cope with it. Is it any wonder they get stressed?

Back to the original thread -

Whilst I agree with you, Otto, regarding having to watch what you say and/or write, that applies to just about everyone as has been seen in this thread not just the young people of today.

I don't think that all kids are brought up wrapped in cotton wool. Yes, some are but I think they are possibly the children of the upper classes, not the majority who have to deal with the real world.

I really do wonder about your mention of advertising saying that you must have this and that etc. I think that sensible people can differentiate between reality and the garbage that advertisers push out (and film makers come to that). If some people actually believe that cr@p then they really need to get real and be themselves, not what they think they should be. The world would be a better place if the young stopped being impressed with the totally unreal world of advertising and films.

I hope I have caused no offense or upset anybody with what I have written ;-)

Otto
9th March 2019, 11:25 PM
No offence at all Keith. But I think that many (most?) young people are more impressionable and hence susceptible to advertising and peer pressure. Why else would they want the latest iPhone or trainers? They grow up surrounded by this stuff and it can take a while before they learn to ignore it. It’s very pervasive, and if their parents are devoted followers of fashion and keeping up with the Jones’s they will find it harder to escape its influence. Advertisers know this which is why they often target young people with fashionable items.

Harold Gough
10th March 2019, 06:39 AM
I saw a man, in his 30s, pay for his pub lunch by placing the face of his watch on the card payment machine.

Harold

DerekW
10th March 2019, 09:56 AM
which part of the process caused you to comment:
the age of the watch wearer
the age of the person using such techniques
surprise that such a process could take place.
the fact that a pub lunch was being electronically processed

PS this is a serious question

Harold Gough
10th March 2019, 09:59 AM
which part of the process caused you to comment:
the age of the watch wearer
the age of the person using such techniques
surprise that such a process could take place.
the fact that a pub lunch was being electronically processed

PS this is a serious question

surprise that such a process could take place

Years of experience have shown me that pub lunches can be paid for electronically. :)

Harold

Otto
10th March 2019, 10:11 AM
Using Apple Pay presumably. I have heard the Apple Watch can be used for that but I've never seen it in action. My iPhone has Apple Pay set up but I've never used that either. It is the future, although the Apple Watch doesn't appeal to me in the slightest :).

Gate Keeper
10th March 2019, 10:21 AM
I accept that my comment continues to cause concern on this forum and I regret making it - not because of any affect it is having on me but simply because in hindsight it was ill-judged, inappropriate and has caused genuine offense to my fellow members. I would advise anyone who thinks action should be taken against me to report the post in question to the other mods and I will step down if necessary. This can be done by using the report button at the top of the original post or by sending a PM to Ian.

You should not throw in the towel because your comments offended 1-2 members. I made a similar comment on a different photography forum 2 years ago. I deleted my comment as soon as I had made it and made a public apology. I had forgotten where I was - the discussion was about luggage and carrying lithium batteries. Afterwards, I walked on hot coals, washed my mouth out with soap and sat on the naughty chair.

I hope you will stay, forgive yourself.

Gate Keeper
10th March 2019, 10:24 AM
Using Apple Pay presumably. I have heard the Apple Watch can be used for that but I've never seen it in action. My iPhone has Apple Pay set up but I've never used that either. It is the future, although the Apple Watch doesn't appeal to me in the slightest :).

Oh thatís interesting, is it difficult to set up?

MJ224
10th March 2019, 10:33 AM
Oh that’s interesting, is it difficult to set up?

Easy to set up, just give Apple your card detail via the Wallet app. I occasionally use the system with my iPhone. Can be really useful if you have forgotten your wallet, something that happens 4 times a year or so...*chr

Otto
10th March 2019, 10:57 AM
https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204506 tells you about setting it up. You need an iPhone 6 or later.

Darkroom
10th March 2019, 11:16 AM
https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204506 tells you about setting it up. You need an iPhone 6 or later.

I use my 10 yr old Nokia phone to pay bills electronically. It's so simple and easy to do. *yes


I just keep my credit card tucked inside the case :)

Darkroom

Harold Gough
10th March 2019, 11:42 AM
Using Apple Pay presumably. I have heard the Apple Watch can be used for that but I've never seen it in action. My iPhone has Apple Pay set up but I've never used that either. It is the future, although the Apple Watch doesn't appeal to me in the slightest :).

They were planning a beer festival. Presumably, the watch owner was a cider fan. :D

Harold

DerekW
10th March 2019, 12:31 PM
Thanks for the pointer to the Watch instructions, payment by watch now set up - payment by phone used quite frequently.

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:18 PM
I've just been chatting in the pub to a 21yo Australian lad who is travelling over here, solo, working his passage and learning about his English and Norwegian ancestors. A very articulate and interesting young man with a remarkably mature world view, although I did have to put him right about Fox News :). I get as p*ssed off with people my age deriding the young as a useless waste of space as I did when I was his age. This particular lad is travelling around Scandinavia and the UK with a 30kg backpack and was quite happy to walk from Scarborough to Whitby carrying it. Snowflake? I don't think so. And you can try talking to any of the Duke of Edinburgh's Award participants we get around here too and you won't find them looking at their "six social media accounts every ten seconds" either. That sort of attitude to young people really winds me up.

I donít think anyone is saying all youngsters are useless, but I do think itís a case that there are more nowadays who are (the snowflakes). You can blame that on whoever / whatever but I donít think it was much easier 50 odd years ago to get a job than it is now. Back then there was certainly talk about how difficult it was and that I was lucky to get an apprenticeship. Perhaps there were more lower paid jobs then which felt like there was more actual jobs rather than decent jobs. It was possible to make progress faster perhaps but it seems everyone nowadays wants to leave school and become a managing director on day two. What happened to working up the ladder, I certainly did (but that stopped pretty soon and I climbed back down again!)
Something that Iím convinced is different now is the fact that everyone seems to want to blame someone else for their misfortune rather than sucking it up and shouldering the blame. Everything has to be someone elseís fault.

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:28 PM
Nobody is forced to have a social media account, and certainly not six of them. Nobody is forced to have a smartphone or to upgrade it every six weeks. Nobody who thinks for themselves needs to be sucked in and constantly fleeced by Ämulti-trillion American businesses.

<snip>

I also accept that older generations have left a hell of a mess behind them including horrendous environmental damage and huge amounts of national debt; but that is nothing new.
Those same people with the smartphones that get upgraded every 6 months and have horrendous monthly contract costs are the ones going out on the town all the time, off for gap years and fancy expensive holidays who then bleat about not being able to afford the deposit for a house - wake up! Do what we did, Dave up, donít go out so much, donít spend, save!!

Donít agree about the older generation making the mess, blame that on the various governments and their policies. Blame it on the banks for making credit so easy that stupid people just suck it all up without giving a thought to paying it back. Blame it on the school system for not teaching basic home economics.

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:31 PM
To be fair to John, he apologised quickly and admitted that his behaviour was ladish and unacceptable. We all make mistakes sometimes - what matters is that we admit and atone for them.

John is a more than decent chap and I think we should look at his comment as a temporary aberration.

Seriously, did someone say that? Might have been an aberration but... words fail me on this!

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:36 PM
O for goodness' sake everyone, lighten up a bit. Taking offence seems almost to be a profession with some people these days (and I mean that in general terms). As I alluded earlier, is it surprising that anxiety is becoming so commonplace when you have to be so careful about what you say even in jest.

I think there is a huge tendency nowadays to be offended for someone else or on someone elseís behalf too.

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:37 PM
I find the Urban Dictionary (https://www.urbandictionary.com/) more use when it comes to words and phrases that have obscure alternative meanings that I may not have been previously aware of :).

How about Rogers Profanisaurus. Very enlightening. :D

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:39 PM
I saw a man, in his 30s, pay for his pub lunch by placing the face of his watch on the card payment machine.

Harold

Doesnít everyone use ApplePay? Shocked!

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:43 PM
Using Apple Pay presumably. I have heard the Apple Watch can be used for that but I've never seen it in action. My iPhone has Apple Pay set up but I've never used that either. It is the future, although the Apple Watch doesn't appeal to me in the slightest :).

Strangely me either, which even I found surprising! I was sure Iíd buy one before they came out but never did having been underwhelmed and itís been the same with every update since. Iím liking the potential medical reporting benefits but whatís good is a sleep monitor, for example, if the stupid battery needs charging overnight!
Improve the battery life, sell decent metal straps at a price thatís sensible and I might get one.

TimP
10th March 2019, 02:46 PM
I use my 10 yr old Nokia phone to pay bills electronically. It's so simple and easy to do. *yes


I just keep my credit card tucked inside the case :)

Darkroom

Ooh! Couldnít you have fun with this idea!! In a busy pub, whip out the old Nokia with contactless credit card tucked underneath and job done! Now where did I leave that old Nokia.....

Otto
10th March 2019, 03:22 PM
How about Rogers Profanisaurus. Very enlightening. :D


Ha! I was going to mention that but thought it might upset a few snowflakes *snowflake

shenstone
10th March 2019, 04:16 PM
Doesnít everyone use ApplePay? Shocked!

Nope.. some of us will still not use apple products ... GooglePay on the other hand I love *chr

Seriously I think the only place I use cash these days are places that don't accept the card/phone. I find that I use cashpoints less and less, maybe every 2 months just to top up my wallet

Regards
Andy

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 05:39 PM
The difference today in my view is the relentless advertising wherever you go insisting that you must have x, y or z to be fulfilled and happy. That did not exist to the extent it does now when I was growing up in the 50s and 60s. League tables, endless comparisons and the like create more pressure, not to mention having to watch what you say and/or write all the time in case somebody somewhere takes offence. I don't think you can equate what young people have to contend with to the pressures and difficulties we had back then. Anxiety and depression are almost endemic among young people, and suicide is the biggest cause of death among young men in particular. Let's also not forget that kids are brought up wrapped in cotton wool so they never really learn about risk and how to cope with it. Is it any wonder they get stressed?

I would broadly agree with you Richard, but whatever happened to personal responsibility? Where do people of any age get the idea that they are entitled to a £millionaire's lifestyle on a regular pay packet?

My wife, who works in a legal practice, often mentions how quite well-paid office staff (circa £30,000 PA) complain that they are 'skint' at least a week before payday each month; and then in the next breath talk about their plans for exotic holidays, their new cars and the 'epic skinfull' they had the night before. And these are supposed to be reasonably intelligent people. :(

Speaking personally I have never felt 'burnt out', (I do wonder if this is a millennial overdramatisation) but I do sometimes feel that life is becoming increasingly difficult; futile even, owing to the way that we do business these days. The internet and the supposed demand for low prices has meant that it is incredibly easy to be parted with money for the latest must-have, but on the few occasions that I buy this stuff I nearly always find myself feeling frustrated and disappointed with my purchases, which rarely seem to do what is promised. (There is usually a clever caveat hidden somewhere.)

To quote a slightly different example, I ordered some parts for my file sever a week ago, including four new 6TB hard drives and a controller card. I originally wanted four drives, but when I came to place the order there were only three in stock, so I settled for three and clicked 'Pay Now', whereupon the money went from my account.

The total cost was around £800 which included next day delivery. That same evening I received an email advising that there was a 'stock shortfall' so the order wouldn't now be shipped until Wednesday, although they already had my money.

Of course parting with money is the easy bit. Trying to speak to someone to resolve the problems afterwards is more difficult. I phoned the company concerned and spent half an hour listening to banal hold music and repeated messages suggesting that I managed my account online. When I eventually spoke to someone I asked if the order could be split. 'No' I would told, otherwise I would have to pay a separate shipping charge.

To cut a long story short, I am still waiting. :mad:

I do wonder whether this cynicism on the part of big business is part of the problem, although it would be fair to say that the 'millennials' have probably driven it harder than any other group.

Jim Ford
10th March 2019, 05:40 PM
Nope.. some of us will still not use apple products

I'm also an Apple atheist!

Apple fans are the sort that sip fashionable 'beers' <snort> out of the bottle, making sure that everyone can see the label! ;)

(See what I've done - I've steered the thread round to beer!)

Jim

TimP
10th March 2019, 05:49 PM
Ha! I was going to mention that but thought it might upset a few snowflakes *snowflake

Tough! They need to grow up.

TimP
10th March 2019, 05:51 PM
Nope.. some of us will still not use apple products ... GooglePay on the other hand I love *chr


I forgot - Google are so good and trustworthy. Silly me!

TimP
10th March 2019, 05:58 PM
I would broadly agree with you Richard, but whatever happened to personal responsibility? Where do people of any age get the idea that they are entitled to a £millionaire's lifestyle on a regular pay packet?


This! So frickin’ true. Sums it up nicely. Entitled people, totally lacking clue and thinking they can have everything the adverts say. No, you need to work it all out and buy what you can afford, no more, ideally something less. Have a contingency plan as one day you will need it. Jeez!

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 06:05 PM
I'm also an Apple atheist!

Apple fans are the sort that sip fashionable 'beers' <snort> out of the bottle, making sure that everyone can see the label! ;)

(See what I've done - I've steered the thread round to beer!)

Jim

Doesn't the label light up as well Jim? ;)

(Actually, I prefer to call them Apple Acolytes. It is a cult following after all.)

TimP
10th March 2019, 06:06 PM
I'm also an Apple atheist!

Apple fans are the sort that sip fashionable 'beers' <snort> out of the bottle, making sure that everyone can see the label! ;)

(See what I've done - I've steered the thread round to beer!)

Jim

Oi! I could be classed as an Apple Fanboi and Iíve more than done my time with PCs. I was building them back in the 80s and after over 30 years decided I just wanted something to work. No pi55ing about with silly drivers and botched updates. I bought an Apple laptop and havenít looked back. Walled garden? Iím in there! I canít understand the hatred that people have for Apple, particularly people in IT. If I can afford a Mercedes (say) why would I drive a Ford?
On the rare occasions Iíve needed support from Apple itís been there, excellent service. Try that with a typical PC (unless I built it for you, in which case Iím there like a shot). I guess the IT hatred is because if everyone had an Spple they would be out of a job. Oh, the irony of IBM preferring their employees to use Apple kit, simply because itís cheaper to support. Whoíd have thunk it.

Internaut
10th March 2019, 06:12 PM
I would broadly agree with you Richard, but whatever happened to personal responsibility?

It died. And not just with the young. I fact, I would argue that when it comes to a lack of personal responsibility, the younger generation have quite an abundance of role models to choose from. How did we get to a place where being a professional t**t on the telly can be seen as a good career choice?

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 06:14 PM
Oi! I could be classed as an Apple Fanboi and Iíve more than done my time with PCs. I was building them back in the 80s and after over 30 years decided I just wanted something to work. No pi55ing about with silly drivers and botched updates. I bought an Apple laptop and havenít looked back. Walled garden? Iím in there! I canít understand the hatred that people have for Apple, particularly people in IT. If I can afford a Mercedes (say) why would I drive a Ford?
On the rare occasions Iíve needed support from Apple itís been there, excellent service. Try that with a typical PC (unless I built it for you, in which case Iím there like a shot). I guess the IT hatred is because if everyone had an Spple they would be out of a job. Oh, the irony of IBM preferring their employees to use Apple kit, simply because itís cheaper to support. Whoíd have thunk it.

I have no problem with Apple equipment as most of it is very good even if it is overpriced, and that Apple are very controlling in their ways.

(Why no 4G option on a MacBook for instance? This is a classic example of the 'walled garden.')

I agree the service is also very good most of the time, and easily accessible, but I struggle with the Apple ideology and the need to become an Apple evangelist if Apple did ever provide 4G in a laptop and I bought one!

I would also have to remember to tell everyone that I was using a MacBook and not just a 'laptop' as I do at present. ;)

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 06:16 PM
How did we get to a place where being a professional t**t on the telly can be seen as a good career choice?

Which one? There are thousands of them to choose from, all vastly overpaid and overrated IMHO. :rolleyes:

Keith-369
10th March 2019, 06:24 PM
Nothing Apple in this house either.

(And certainly no FGD's in the fruit bowl ;))

shenstone
10th March 2019, 06:30 PM
Sorry for the distraction by comments on different IT manufacturers

I think the key is to be reasonable to others and not expect too much of them at the same time. The big thing is speed of communication which brings less and less calm thinking and a tendency to overreact. I've seen that in myself and I don't like it, but find it hard to stop at times.

Whatever age we are calm reflection helps

Regards
Andy

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 06:40 PM
This! So frickiní true. Sums it up nicely. Entitled people, totally lacking clue and thinking they can have everything the adverts say. No, you need to work it all out and buy what you can afford, no more, ideally something less. Have a contingency plan as one day you will need it. Jeez!

I was going to say - some of them spend more on Gym membership than I spend on our mortgage. Anything short of a BMW X7 or Audi Q9 is frowned upon in the Gym car park. Yet they complain they cannot afford to buy a house. :confused:

Could there be a connection somewhere I wonder?

Otto
10th March 2019, 06:42 PM
I'm not an Apple fanboy by any stretch of the imagination but my iPhone "just works" and I'm happy that it does. I don't use any other Apple products and only use the free bytes that iCloud offers to keep my contacts and calendar backed up. When I bought this PC a couple of years ago there was an iMac of almost identical hardware spec (but twice the price) next to it. I tried opening a photo on both and the PC was much faster, and I didn't want to have to learn MacOS. Choice made!


As for people feeling "entitled" I think that goes back to the Thatcher years when it was "every man for himself" and "on your bike" if you couldn't get a job where you live. Together with media and peer pressure meaning everyone wants it and wants it now, ideally without paying for it. There's no easy way out of that.

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 06:50 PM
As for people feeling "entitled" I think that goes back to the Thatcher years when it was "every man for himself" and "on your bike" if you couldn't get a job where you live. Together with media and peer pressure meaning everyone wants it and wants it now, ideally without paying for it. There's no easy way out of that.

I'm not so sure. From my observations the 'entitled' attitude seemed to accelerate rapidly during the years of the Blair Rich project.

Thatcher might have fostered a degree of "every man for himself" but there was far more personal responsibility in those days.

TimP
10th March 2019, 07:13 PM
I'm not so sure. From my observations the 'entitled' attitude seemed to accelerate rapidly during the years of the Blair Rich project.

Thatcher might have fostered a degree of "every man for himself" but there was far more personal responsibility in those days.

Thatcher should be blamed for a hell of a lot but self entitlement isnít one of those things. Weíre she still here (spit!) Iím pretty sure we wouldnít be in the cluster feck that is Brexit.

Darkroom
10th March 2019, 07:43 PM
I was going to say - some of them spend more on Gym membership than I spend on our mortgage. Anything short of a BMW X7 or Audi Q9 is frowned upon in the Gym car park. Yet they complain they cannot afford to buy a house. :confused:


I always used to get pleasure from pulling into the car park of posh, up-market hotels and restraunts in my old white Ford Transit van. I still have a smaller van and Wifey has an MPV. The van is just so useful and we still use it to go on holiday in the UK. Must admit we have never had a snotty comment from anywhere that we go on holiday in the van.


Darkroom

Naughty Nigel
10th March 2019, 10:41 PM
I would enjoy parking an old van rather close to those Audi's and BMW's straddling parking spaces at the supermarket.

And as you say, a van is very useful when you need to shift stuff.

MJ224
10th March 2019, 10:55 PM
Not at all, just fed up with all youngsters being branded as useless.
Usually by miserable old sods who display similar traits, but won't admit it
How about they have to keep getting the latest phone. Substitute camera for phone and that applies to a good few on here.
Older generation have left a right pile of dung for our kids, the latest being leaving the EU.

They have pressure piled on in school and by parents, peer pressure on social media too doesn't help.
Not sure why anyone here who has done ok from life has to post such things, condescending at best and downright hateful at worst.

Must say out of the few photography sites I have posted on this has some of the nastiest members.




Undoubtedly time for your exit as we are so rotten...……………..*chr

Gate Keeper
11th March 2019, 05:07 AM
Good morning all and welcome to the day, I am off to the hospital this morning - nothing to worry about. The wife complained about my snoring to the docs. I am picking up a sleep apnea home kit for the 8 hours test.

How is everyone? :)

Gate Keeper
11th March 2019, 05:18 AM
I always used to get pleasure from pulling into the car park of posh, up-market hotels and restraunts in my old white Ford Transit van. I still have a smaller van and Wifey has an MPV. The van is just so useful and we still use it to go on holiday in the UK. Must admit we have never had a snotty comment from anywhere that we go on holiday in the van.


Darkroom

In November, I had to use the services of a removals company for the move from London to Bristol. They used a Luton van and 2 guys. I was charged £850 cash, a nice earner. It was a shame I didnít know anyone with a van ;) We have often talked about buying a van for touring the UK in or for moving things.

TimP
11th March 2019, 07:23 AM
In November, I had to use the services of a removals company for the move from London to Bristol. They used a Luton van and 2 guys. I was charged £850 cash, a nice earner. It was a shame I didnít know anyone with a van ;) We have often talked about buying a van for touring the UK in or for moving things.

Couldnít you have hired one? Saying that, itís hard work lugging stuff in and out of vans but even so, as you say, £850 is pretty good for a days work for two blokes. Iíve never earnt that kind of money in proper paid employment yet the black economy does nothing but moan about hard times.

Harold Gough
11th March 2019, 07:43 AM
Doesnít everyone use ApplePay? Shocked!

Do you get a refund when the clocks go back? :D

Harold

Harold Gough
11th March 2019, 07:46 AM
In November, I had to use the services of a removals company for the move from London to Bristol. They used a Luton van and 2 guys. I was charged £850 cash, a nice earner. It was a shame I didnít know anyone with a van ;) We have often talked about buying a van for touring the UK in or for moving things.

We have moved house twice and I drove the van (7.5T) each time, plus a trailer for greenhouses the second time. When I renewed my licence at 70 I didn't apply for that part of the permit to be renewed.

Harold

TimP
11th March 2019, 07:52 AM
Do you get a refund when the clocks go back? :D

Harold

Of course, but when they go forward you owe it all back again.

shenstone
11th March 2019, 10:32 AM
Sorry closing this thread for now as there have been personal comments made about members - time to reflect folk

Please all remember this is a photography thread and we need to bring in people who want to be members - we have the lounge area for off topic conversations, but as it says "Just keep it clean and polite!"

Ian
11th March 2019, 12:50 PM
Disrespectful and demeaning comments about anyone are not acceptable on our forum.

Plenty of us have children who would be very unhappy at being classified as 'snowflakes'. I, personally, find the term disrespectful at the very least as it is a generalised term that makes no distinctions.

As Andy has said, this is a photography forum. The Out of Focus off-topic area is provided for some enjoyable discussion of non-photography topics.

If it continues to be used as a platform for attacking others, I will have to consider, seriously, whether or not this section of the forum has a future.

Ian