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chorleyjeff
3rd June 2017, 06:53 PM
I am now thinking of upgrading my long focus lens but I am wondering whether the em10 sensor is capable of matching the performance of good quality prime lenses e.g. Oly 60mm macro.
It is quite easy to get lens resolution figures ( although I assume there is sample error ) but I can't find comparable information about sensors. Can anyone advise if and where such information is available ?
In short, at the moment, I would like to know if my sensor can show the difference in resolution between my 40-150 f4 to f5.6 zoom at 60mm and a prime 60mm lens and can this be detected in a 12" x 16" print ?
Any information would be gratefully received.
Jeff

pdk42
4th June 2017, 08:03 AM
In short, at the moment, I would like to know if my sensor can show the difference in resolution between my 40-150 f4 to f5.6 zoom at 60mm and a prime 60mm lens and can this be detected in a 12" x 16" print ?
Any information would be gratefully received.
Jeff

In short - yes and no.

At 16Mp the sensor is more than good enough to distinguish between lens quality (although the 40-150R is pretty good for its price). However, relatively small prints are unlikely to reveal much of a difference.

David M
4th June 2017, 10:00 AM
There's so many variables it's impossible to answer.

chorleyjeff
4th June 2017, 12:18 PM
In short - yes and no.

At 16Mp the sensor is more than good enough to distinguish between lens quality (although the 40-150R is pretty good for its price). However, relatively small prints are unlikely to reveal much of a difference.

Thanks for answer.
That's what I intuitively thought but wasn't sure.
Probably better to spend the money on travel, ink and paper.
Jeff

chorleyjeff
4th June 2017, 12:30 PM
There's so many variables it's impossible to answer.
Same landscape/townscape subject in cloudy bright or sunny weather, aperture, ISO, shutter speed, raw conversion in LR, print from LR, same printer , ink and paper. Displayed behind glass in frame on well lit wall.
In other words photographs taken within the modest limitations of a consumer lens and processed normally.
Jeff

David M
4th June 2017, 12:49 PM
Same landscape/townscape subject in cloudy bright or sunny weather, aperture, ISO, shutter speed, raw conversion in LR, print from LR, same printer , ink and paper. Displayed behind glass in frame on well lit wall.
In other words photographs taken within the modest limitations of a consumer lens and processed normally.
Jeff

So how many ways can the use of a lens hood affect image quality? Time of day/quality of the light? And of course if your tripod is up to the job.

chorleyjeff
4th June 2017, 04:05 PM
So how many ways can the use of a lens hood affect image quality? Time of day/quality of the light? And of course if your tripod is up to the job.

And so on ad infinitum.
Jeff

AMc
5th June 2017, 12:47 PM
DXO mark provide some useful comparison tools for lenses.

This indicates you'd see a benefit but nothing beats hands on experience.

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Compare/Side-by-side/Olympus-MZUIKO-DIGITAL-ED-40-150mm-40-56-on-Olympus-OM-D-E-M10-versus-Olympus-MZUIKO-DIGITAL-ED-60mm-F28-Macro-on-Olympus-OM-D-E-M10__415_937_897_937

chorleyjeff
5th June 2017, 02:34 PM
DXO mark provide some useful comparison tools for lenses.

This indicates you'd see a benefit but nothing beats hands on experience.

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Compare/Side-by-side/Olympus-MZUIKO-DIGITAL-ED-40-150mm-40-56-on-Olympus-OM-D-E-M10-versus-Olympus-MZUIKO-DIGITAL-ED-60mm-F28-Macro-on-Olympus-OM-D-E-M10__415_937_897_937

Thanks.
I find DXO quite difficult to use. I would expect a tightly controlled test to show differences but as you say it is real world experience that would give a better guide.
I assume from replies that such comparisons are not done by expert testers so all that is available is anecdotal information.
Jeff

AMc
5th June 2017, 04:40 PM
Perhaps you'll tell the difference, perhaps not?

On the EM-10, DXO shows the cheap 40-150 at 6 Perceptual Megapixel (P-Mpix) and the optimum sharpness at 40mm f11
The 60mm f2.8 gets 9P-Mpix and is apparently best at 60mm f2.8

If you choose the EM-1 then this goes to 6 vs 10 (for the 60mm) - so you get no advantage from the more expensive body with the cheaper lens but you do from the 60mm.
If you select the EM-1 Mkii then it goes up to 7 vs 13 so the Mkii can apparently squeeze a bit more from the cheaper lens but more from the 60mm.

It suggests to me that (unsurprisingly) the more expensive prime lens is capable of more than the cheaper zoom.

I assume that DXO have scientific methodology in how this is measured otherwise what would be the point?

If that equates to better pictures and then prints, in practice depends on so many other factors it's probably irrelevant to most of us.

I think you're better off spending money on experiences than things but each to their own ;)

chorleyjeff
5th June 2017, 06:01 PM
Perhaps you'll tell the difference, perhaps not?

On the EM-10, DXO shows the cheap 40-150 at 6 Perceptual Megapixel (P-Mpix) and the optimum sharpness at 40mm f11
The 60mm f2.8 gets 9P-Mpix and is apparently best at 60mm f2.8

If you choose the EM-1 then this goes to 6 vs 10 (for the 60mm) - so you get no advantage from the more expensive body with the cheaper lens but you do from the 60mm.
If you select the EM-1 Mkii then it goes up to 7 vs 13 so the Mkii can apparently squeeze a bit more from the cheaper lens but more from the 60mm.

It suggests to me that (unsurprisingly) the more expensive prime lens is capable of more than the cheaper zoom.

I assume that DXO have scientific methodology in how this is measured otherwise what would be the point?

If that equates to better pictures and then prints, in practice depends on so many other factors it's probably irrelevant to most of us.

I think you're better off spending money on experiences than things but each to their own ;)

Thanks for the interpretation of theDXO information. It is what I was interested to know i.e. my camera sensor would be able to record more detail with the prime lens but whether this would translate to more information in a print is a moot point.
I appreciate the prime lens has other qualities that distinguish it from the low price zoom.
And yes I shall probably produce better pictures spending the money on going places and concentrating on actually taking pictures.😄 But GAS is a strong syndrome.😦
Jeff

David M
5th June 2017, 09:47 PM
The 'feel' of the image is more important than the ultimate picture quality. I've had a double page spread in a local tourism guide taken with an E-410 and one of the plastic kit lenses.

Ricoh
6th June 2017, 08:05 AM
“Sharpness is a bourgeois concept ” Henri Cartier-Bresson

AMc
6th June 2017, 08:31 AM
And yes I shall probably produce better pictures spending the money on going places and concentrating on actually taking pictures.😄 But GAS is a strong syndrome.😦
Jeff
I satisfy my GAS by spending hours researching things when I probably should be working then deciding in the end I can't afford/don't want to spend enough to warrant the purchase :)
I should probably just go out and take pictures instead but then I'd really not be working as opposed to not really working ...:D

chorleyjeff
6th June 2017, 11:57 AM
“Sharpness is a bourgeois concept ” Henri Cartier-Bresson

What's wrong with being a bourgeois sort of chap ?
I like sharp. I also like fuzzy when appropriate.
Jeff