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blu-by-u
21st March 2017, 07:54 AM
It's been a few months and 1 firmware update since the launch.

I am still having problems with the EM1ii. Not sure if other users of this flagship are facing similar issues and are suffering in silence. The AF seems to work very differently from the EM1mk1.

When attach with the 40-150 or the 12-40, I am getting the same issues. The camera will focus and give a confirm AF beep and in my case a Green Rectangle flash. But when you refocus on a same object, the screen defocus and then refocus. Sometimes, it's totally off focus and yet the AF confirm beep and that blink.

I don't see that in the EM1mk1. The EM1ii is suppose to be faster in AF and more accurate but if out of focus it can still give a confirmation beep, would this also be the cause of many out of focus and not so accurate photographs?

Walti
21st March 2017, 08:46 AM
I've rattled off a few in the garden this morning and am quite underwhelmed so far!

I'm going to do a back to back to see what the difference is, but I'm getting a lot of out of focus and blurred photos I simply don't get with the MKi - so some settings to be investigated I think (hope)...

I'm disappointed with the my sets on the dial only as well (I've set two up onto buttons on the MKi which allows me to switch without taking my eye from the viewfinder.... I'm not sure I can manage this so well from the dial)

MikeH
21st March 2017, 08:47 AM
I've only just got the MK2 (Sunday) so cannot really comment as I've not had much time to test other than a few out of the window, but I haven't noticed the problem you are talking about

pdk42
21st March 2017, 09:26 AM
No problems with AF on mine so far. Seems more accurate with my 50-200 in fact. Since it's the ED, the focus limiter really helps since I can set it for 5m-infinity (or whatever) which stops the thing racking back and forth through the whole focus range.

Focus accuracy on the u43 lenses seems just as good as on the mk i.

Just a thought if you are having difficulty - because it's PDAF, is there a need for calibration. I see that there is a micro-adjustment feature. Personally I hope I never have to use this - it was one of the things that I was very happy to leave behind when I moved from Canon.

Ross the fiddler
21st March 2017, 10:26 AM
No problems with AF on mine so far. Seems more accurate with my 50-200 in fact. Since it's the ED, the focus limiter really helps since I can set it for 5m-infinity (or whatever) which stops the thing racking back and forth through the whole focus range.

Focus accuracy on the u43 lenses seems just as good as on the mk i.

Just a thought if you are having difficulty - because it's PDAF, is there a need for calibration. I see that there is a micro-adjustment feature. Personally I hope I never have to use this - it was one of the things that I was very happy to leave behind when I moved from Canon.

You've touched on the point that this model will use PD-AF (with CD-AF using DualFast AF (https://www.olympus.com.au/Products/Interchangeable-Lens-Cameras/Olympus-OM-D/E-M1-Mark-II/Features/High-speed-Performance)) & would focus differently in certain circumstances to the E-M1 with u43 lenses. I had to adjust the micro AF adjustment in my E-M1 for my 50-200 SWD lens at the tele end (+3) because of the lens calibration & I would not be surprised that there might need to be adjustment needed with the u43 lenses too. I suspect it might have a lot to do with technique for the above users though as I think the two focussing methods needs to be used to each of their advantages, such as the focus area with CD-AF needs to cover the subject with contrasting detail & not the background (as much as possible), while PD-AF will tend to focus on detail in the foreground.

Since using my 40-150 Pro lens (& especially with the MC14) using CD-AF (on the E-M1), I find it may not lock onto focus as easily as the 50-200 SWD lens did (with PD-AF) in some circumstances & I have to be more careful with the size of the Focus Area, because of it. Anyhow, the point I'm trying to make is, technique &/or Micro Adjustment might need to change with the Mk II model over other models. I would think it should be more like using a DSLR for technique, but then I haven't had a chance to try one yet. :rolleyes:

*chr

MJ224
21st March 2017, 11:04 AM
I've rattled off a few in the garden this morning and am quite underwhelmed so far!

I'm going to do a back to back to see what the difference is, but I'm getting a lot of out of focus and blurred photos I simply don't get with the MKi - so some settings to be investigated I think (hope)...

I'm disappointed with the my sets on the dial only as well (I've set two up onto buttons on the MKi which allows me to switch without taking my eye from the viewfinder.... I'm not sure I can manage this so well from the dial)

Me too!!

just assume I need to get to grips with the beast better. There are so many tweaks to be made. I think I just have to get used to it..........

Walti
21st March 2017, 11:43 AM
I've just been out and fired off 300 photos, with the MKi I would have got a far better hit rate than I have so far with the MKii.

My head was telling me to do the test and wow before buying, and my conclusions so far is that if I had done so I wouldn't have bought it!

I need to stop and seriously look at the results and try and understand why I am so disappointed with them so far!

DavyG
21st March 2017, 12:10 PM
I've just been out and fired off 300 photos, with the MKi I would have got a far better hit rate than I have so far with the MKii.

My head was telling me to do the test and wow before buying, and my conclusions so far is that if I had done so I wouldn't have bought it!

I need to stop and seriously look at the results and try and understand why I am so disappointed with them so far!

I've been using the E-M1 II for circa 3 months now and have had no focus problems at all.

The AF speed and accuracy is amazing, I was achieving BiF and DiF with the E-M1, I think the Mark II will make these a lot easier to capture.

I think you've seen some of the images I'm capturing with this body, I'm very pleased so far.

I'd be interested to know which SD cards and lenses you're using, settings and shutter speeds, these may help identify why you're having problems.

A few example images with exif intact would also help.

Dave

pdk42
21st March 2017, 12:45 PM
There have been a lot of reviews of the mark II on most of the usual internet sites and I've not seen any negative comments about AF accuracy. There have certainly been some reviewers saying that it's not quite top of class in subject tracking compared to the D500 and XT2, but that's a long way from saying it's inaccurate.

It seems odd though that two experienced Olympus users are seeing problems. Would be very interested to see examples.

Bikie John
21st March 2017, 02:13 PM
I have used one for a few indoor music gigs, and one rugby match on a fairly gloomy afternoon. Both situations can be quite challenging, and it is very difficult to be at all precise about results. But my initial gut feel is that focussing is faster than the Mark I (and 4/3 "real" DSLRs from what I remember) and just as accurate if not better.

John

Graham_of_Rainham
21st March 2017, 02:25 PM
Save all your settings, then do a full reset and try again...

Growltiger
21st March 2017, 03:04 PM
There are so many things that a user can do to make it harder for the camera to decide where to focus. Some examples:
- Use lots of focus points.
- Turn on the Face feature.
- Turn on Tracking.

So I suggest anyone new to the camera starts with S-AF, single focus point, no Face. Check it works really well.

Then set it to C-AF (no tracking), single focus point, no face, and try again. Check that works really well.

Only after that start experimenting with the other settings.

Walti
21st March 2017, 03:51 PM
There are so many things that a user can do to make it harder for the camera to decide where to focus. Some examples:
- Use lots of focus points.
- Turn on the Face feature.
- Turn on Tracking.

So I suggest anyone new to the camera starts with S-AF, single focus point, no Face. Check it works really well.

Then set it to C-AF (no tracking), single focus point, no face, and try again. Check that works really well.

Only after that start experimenting with the other settings.

I'm getting quite good results with the MKi so have done a similar set of settings for the MKii - much as your list but 9 point for BiF against a plain sky.

I need to look at the lens settings by the sound of it, but I will do some back to back comparisons to show why I'm so disappointed - all the reviews I've read to date suggest there's a massive improvement so I must be doing something wrong to see a decline in performance!

BreezeG
21st March 2017, 04:52 PM
Meh!, just went out today to trail the camera on birds. About 2% keeper rate!
Obviously operator error, Ive just noticed both tracking and face recognition are on.
Must do better, will try again tomorrow.
Loving the resolving power of the 14-150 f2.8 Pro though, these were taken with the 1.4 TC attached.

DavyG
21st March 2017, 05:29 PM
I'm getting quite good results with the MKi so have done a similar set of settings for the MKii - much as your list but 9 point for BiF against a plain sky.

I need to look at the lens settings by the sound of it, but I will do some back to back comparisons to show why I'm so disappointed - all the reviews I've read to date suggest there's a massive improvement so I must be doing something wrong to see a decline in performance!

I did the same, I copied my E-M1 settings to my Mark II and tweaked from there.

If you are using sequential H or Procapture H be aware that the camera only uses S-AF, it will provide C-AF on sequential L or Procapture L.

For BiF against a clear sky, try using all focal points, for BiF against a busy background try either 9 or 5 focal points.

I'd still be interested to hear which lenses you're using.

Dave

DavyG
21st March 2017, 05:30 PM
Meh!, just went out today to trail the camera on birds. About 2% keeper rate!
Obviously operator error, Ive just noticed both tracking and face recognition are on.
Must do better, will try again tomorrow.
Loving the resolving power of the 14-150 f2.8 Pro though, these were taken with the 1.4 TC attached.

Turn face recognition off, it slows the camera down.

Please see my reply to Walti also,

Dave

pdk42
21st March 2017, 05:34 PM
Meh!, just went out today to trail the camera on birds. About 2% keeper rate!
Obviously operator error, Ive just noticed both tracking and face recognition are on.
Must do better, will try again tomorrow.
Loving the resolving power of the 14-150 f2.8 Pro though, these were taken with the 1.4 TC attached.

Tracking is a waste of space - turn it off. Face recognition is very good, but only for faces ;)


I discussed CAF setup with Tesni Ward, who spoke at The Photography Show about using the mkii on wildlife (with excellent results), and her recommendations are:

- CAF Scanner - mode 2
- Tracking off
- Single focus point, with 5 or 9 point sometimes if the subject suits it
- AF Lock - tight (-5)

Technique then requires keeping the subject under the focus point (s). If Olympus ever fix tracking, it'll make this aspect a lot simpler!

DavyG
21st March 2017, 05:40 PM
Tracking is a waste of space - turn it off. Face recognition is very good, but only for faces ;)


I discussed CAF setup with Tesni Ward, who spoke at The Photography Show about using the mkii on wildlife (with excellent results), and her recommendations are:

- CAF scanner mode 2
- Tracking off
- Single focus point, with 5 or 9 point sometimes
- AF lock - tight (-5)

Technique then requires keeping the subject under the focus point (s).

I disagree about tracking, I used it on the E-M1 and continue to do so on the Mark II.

The camera will only track as long as the operator is keeping up with subject, I agree it's not perfect but it does work.

I also found it useful when photographing static Damselfiles and Dragonflies on windy days, the focus point moved with the subject and helped increase my keeper rate, ymmv.

Thanks for listing Tesni's recommendations, I'll compare these with my current settings.

Dave

Gwyver
21st March 2017, 05:47 PM
Meh!, just went out today to trail the camera on birds. About 2% keeper rate!
Obviously operator error, Ive just noticed both tracking and face recognition are on.
Must do better, will try again tomorrow.
Loving the resolving power of the 14-150 f2.8 Pro though, these were taken with the 1.4 TC attached.

Have you checked the RLS Priority settings for S-AF & C-AF? (See Cog C1).
Also AF Limiter - Priority Release (See Cog A1) - if you're using the AF-Limiter functions.
If these items are set to "On" - the shutter can be fired even though AF confirmation has not occurred.

pdk42
21st March 2017, 05:49 PM
I disagree about tracking, I used it on the E-M1 and continue to do so on the Mark II.

The camera will only track as long as the operator is keeping up with subject, I agree it's not perfect but it does work.

I also found it useful when photographing static Damselfiles and Dragonflies on windy days, the focus point moved with the subject and helped increase my keeper rate, ymmv.

Thanks for listing Tesni's recommendations, I'll compare these with my current settings.

Dave

Ah, so you have managed to get tracking to work then? That's good to know - I've always found it failed miserably. What I do know is that it's a feature that's a hang over from older implementations. I suspect it only works using contrast AF too, but I could be wrong.

BreezeG
21st March 2017, 06:12 PM
Have you checked the RLS Priority settings for S-AF & C-AF? (See Cog C1).
Also AF Limiter - Priority Release (See Cog A1) - if you're using the AF-Limiter functions.
If these items are set to "On" - the shutter can be fired even though AF confirmation has not occurred.

Thanks for that, will check them out.

c12402
21st March 2017, 11:43 PM
Not sure this case is connected with the discussion, but just in case it may help....

I'm currently in the process of fine tuning my settings on the em1.2 (coming from em5) for birding.

One major enhancement to my focus rate was to set lens reset parameter to OFF (default is ON). The issue is that in the time lapse between one bird and the next, the camera frecuently enters in idle mode, and this mode reset the lens forcing it to refocus the scene, making useless to pre-focus at a given place where you are expecting the bird to stop.

I was previously assuming that this reset happens when camera is switched off, but it also happens when entering in Low power modes.

With birds moving so fast, I was missing focus constantly...

Greytop
22nd March 2017, 12:33 AM
No focusing problems to report with mine.
Very pleased with the results both from S-AF and C-AF.

blu-by-u
22nd March 2017, 03:26 AM
I've rattled off a few in the garden this morning and am quite underwhelmed so far!

I'm going to do a back to back to see what the difference is, but I'm getting a lot of out of focus and blurred photos I simply don't get with the MKi - so some settings to be investigated I think (hope)...

I'm disappointed with the my sets on the dial only as well (I've set two up onto buttons on the MKi which allows me to switch without taking my eye from the viewfinder.... I'm not sure I can manage this so well from the dial)

Seems Me and Walti are the only 2 having issues?:confused:

I do not use the multi AF points, I have set it to single AF smack in the middle. SA-F in all my test. :) off. Question, Did I get as lemon set? Or after all these years of using an Oly camera, this is one unit that really need me to change my shooting style?:eek:

Here is an example of the error..all shots are shot with Single exposure SA-F.

The subject is practically stationary. I do not have this issue with the mk1.

The start of the sequence, is tack sharp. No complains.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2890/33451949501_8e3d296675.jpg

Crop of the above.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2830/33424392262_78136e9262.jpg

The camera beeps an AF confirmation and..:eek:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2857/33424311282_52518b1cc2.jpg

Crop of the above..
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2930/33424393132_4a6b99aeac.jpg

A few shots later..
https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3950/33197928710_ac68fa8346.jpg

Crop of the above...
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2882/33424394022_a5194960ef.jpg

More pictures of the sequence are here. (https://www.flickr.com/photos/27822763@N00/albums/72157678355110603)

Phill D
22nd March 2017, 06:42 AM
Interesting comments and info here. So far on my one outing I found the Mk2 focusing to be much more assured than my mk1 especially with my Lumix 14-140. The 40-150 also seemed to work well but then it did with my mark 1. I. It's a lot better than the mk1 with my Pan/Leica 14-150. I think the main improvement is from the cross type focus points.

Daveart
22nd March 2017, 09:21 AM
Hi I have looked at your sequence of images A your shutter speed was 1/100th

B you were shooting in Single AF mode,

C The subject is moving parts of the body i.e. arms maybe head rocking back and Forth

D.shallow depth of field ie f2.8 as s-af only focuses upon the first frame would explain first is sharp all this information would indicate that to be operator error not camera error. Any movment at these settings with a telephoto lens would show some form of out of focus blurring on shots after the first.

This is my observation of these shots and camera settings.

Walti
22nd March 2017, 10:13 AM
I'm still trying to work out what I've done wrong - The camera seems fine and has been subjected to a factory reset, so I'll start again!

Enthusiasm has taken a bit of a hit though!

I think I need to switch to CF+TR to resolve the issues I think I've had - I'll give it a go and report back!

Bengeo
22nd March 2017, 10:14 AM
No AF problems here. Been using the Mark 2 since last December and find it better than the Mark 1. It will be nice to have the smaller focus point if they reintroduce that.

Zuiko
22nd March 2017, 11:00 AM
Hi I have looked at your sequence of images A your shutter speed was 1/100th

B you were shooting in Single AF mode,

C The subject is moving parts of the body i.e. arms maybe head rocking back and Forth

D.shallow depth of field ie f2.8 as s-af only focuses upon the first frame would explain first is sharp all this information would indicate that to be operator error not camera error. Any movment at these settings with a telephoto lens would show some form of out of focus blurring on shots after the first.

This is my observation of these shots and camera settings.

The problem is that Image stabilization is so good we take it for granted. It is easy to forget that whilst it prevents blurring due to camera shake, it has no effect upon subject movement. I suspect the subject was quite an animated speaker and 1/100th of a second was just too slow. The ISO was only 400 and I would have been inclined to crank it up to at least 1600 for a faster shutter speed.

TonyR
22nd March 2017, 11:02 AM
Not sure this case is connected with the discussion, but just in case it may help....

I'm currently in the process of fine tuning my settings on the em1.2 (coming from em5) for birding.

One major enhancement to my focus rate was to set lens reset parameter to OFF (default is ON). The issue is that in the time lapse between one bird and the next, the camera frecuently enters in idle mode, and this mode reset the lens forcing it to refocus the scene, making useless to pre-focus at a given place where you are expecting the bird to stop.

I was previously assuming that this reset happens when camera is switched off, but it also happens when entering in Low power modes.

With birds moving so fast, I was missing focus constantly...

Good catch! I previously thought that Lens Reset only reset the focal length of an electrically zoomed lens, not the focus distance.

Grumpy Hec
22nd March 2017, 11:57 AM
Ditto on the positive side. I have been using since December and for what I do the AF is a huge improvement in both speed and accuracy. The only issues I have experienced are around very low contrast subjects which is not surprising but even then it is much improved over the MK1.

It should be said though that I do not do action/BIF so my comments should be taken in that context.

Hec

pdk42
22nd March 2017, 12:43 PM
I'm still trying to work out what I've done wrong - The camera seems fine and has been subjected to a factory reset, so I'll start again!

Enthusiasm has taken a bit of a hit though!

I think I need to switch to CF+TR to resolve the issues I think I've had - I'll give it a go and report back!

Oh dear - that's not a great place to be! Let's see if we can collectively get you back on track!

Personally, I have grave doubts over the use of tracking having had very little success with it in the past. Like a lot of fancy automation, it removes control from the user and unless it's 100% reliable it'll only likely make things worse to diagnose.

IMHO whenever there is a problem, it's best to return to the simplest setup possible and then take it from there. How about this for an approach:

- Start with single point S-AF on a static subject with a tripod. Sounds stupid, but it'll at least remove concerns around basic lens and camera calibration. Might be worth trying it with a few lenses too.

- Move to hand-held. Tests shutter speed and IS issues.

- Move to CAF, no-tracking and with a single AF point. Use first on a static subject. Maybe doesn't add much, but it gives C-AF a run. Keep to static subjects, but move aim from things near to far.

- Keep on C-AF single point and play with the C-AF settings - AF Scanner and AF Lock settings (loose/tight). Keep to same static subjects and see how the settings change behaviour.

- Bring in multi-point CAF. See how the camera chooses its selected focus point, again keeping to static subjects.

- Switch to moving subjects and repeat the C-AF tests. Start with single point and something simple such as cars or bicycles, keeping the focus point(s) over the subject by camera movement. Test movement both in parallel plane to camera (subject not changing distance) and perpendicular (changing distance). Ensure that shutter speed is high enough.

- Play around with different subjects and different movement patterns. Experiment with C-AF settings, esp CAF Lock.

- Lastly, see if tracking helps at all. It should, if working properly, remove the need to keep the subject under a focus point.

Depending on where problems begin, you'll have at least some handle on where to go looking for a fix.

Hope this is useful and not teaching anyone to suck eggs!!

Walti
22nd March 2017, 01:19 PM
Oh dear - that's not a great place to be! Let's see if we can collectively get you back on track!

Personally, I have grave doubts over the use of tracking having had very little success with it in the past. Like a lot of fancy automation, it removes control from the user and unless it's 100% reliable it'll only likely make things worse to diagnose.

IMHO whenever there is a problem, it's best to return to the simplest setup possible and then take it from there. How about this for an approach:

- Start with single point S-AF on a static subject with a tripod. Sounds stupid, but it'll at least remove concerns around basic lens and camera calibration. Might be worth trying it with a few lenses too.

- Move to hand-held. Tests shutter speed and IS issues.

- Move to CAF, no-tracking and with a single AF point. Use first on a static subject. Maybe doesn't add much, but it gives C-AF a run. Keep to static subjects, but move aim from things near to far.

- Keep on C-AF single point and play with the C-AF settings - AF Scanner and AF Lock settings (loose/tight). Keep to same static subjects and see how the settings change behaviour.

- Bring in multi-point CAF. See how the camera chooses its selected focus point, again keeping to static subjects.

- Switch to moving subjects and repeat the C-AF tests. Start with single point and something simple such as cars or bicycles, keeping the focus point(s) over the subject by camera movement. Test movement both in parallel plane to camera (subject not changing distance) and perpendicular (changing distance). Ensure that shutter speed is high enough.

- Play around with different subjects and different movement patterns. Experiment with C-AF settings, esp CAF Lock.

- Lastly, see if tracking helps at all. It should, if working properly, remove the need to keep the subject under a focus point.

Depending on where problems begin, you'll have at least some handle on where to go looking for a fix.

Hope this is useful and not teaching anyone to suck eggs!!

Paul,

Nice to see it all written out neatly! Many thanks.

I'm working through a similar set of tests and have found that I'm now getting better than the MKi - so that's a start - the factory reset does seem to have done something (that I can't find) which has improved things markedly, and I'm now getting reasonable performance across the board. (I ditched all my settings and started again! - to be sure it wasn't a stray setting).

I've got onto the C-AF settings and looks like the tracking is sorting most of the issue out, however trying to photograph songbirds in a tree the focussing keeps bouncing between the original subject and the nearest branch! which is fine once you've realised it's going to do it (so you use C-AF selectively).

It does look like some of my issues are grounded in the difference in the way C-AF operates across the two cameras and I need to change my work to match!

I have also had a battery out to reset lock up and a "check lens" issue though today, so I'm beginning to think I've got a rogue camera!

Walti
22nd March 2017, 03:49 PM
Normal service has been resumed:

I think that the camera must have been out of the box and played with by the dealer at some point! I've ended up doing TWO factory resets! and re-started plugging through all the menus to get somewhere near normality!

I have also found that the C-AF definitely works differently (though that was the whole point so no real surprise) and I have had to adapt very slightly to it! Switching to C-AF+tr has solved some of the issues I was finding yesterday.

I have found that if the subject is not in brilliant sunshine, the C-AF does wander a few mm - but understanding that allows for a work around!

Anyway some straight out of the camera photos: ALL are E-M1 MKii, 300mm f4 plus MC1.4. ISO3200, 1/1000, f5.6

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220153.jpg

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220154.jpg

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220155.jpg

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220156.jpg

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220157.jpg

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220158.jpg

Walti
22nd March 2017, 03:57 PM
PS - I wouldn't have put ANY ISO3200 photos up for people to look at from the MKi - so there IS a difference!

Growltiger
22nd March 2017, 04:05 PM
Now you can move on to trying ProCapture Low with C-AF.

Walti
22nd March 2017, 04:06 PM
And a post-processed version of one of them!

I think I'm a little happier now! ;)

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/20170322-P3220155-2.jpg

Walti
22nd March 2017, 04:13 PM
Now you can move on to trying ProCapture Low with C-AF.

I'm just relieved that I've gone from a place where I thought I'd made a massive mistake with the camera to actually thinking there is an improvement over the MKi - yesterday was VERY worrying!

PRO capture and high res are on the menu for investigation!

MJ224
22nd March 2017, 09:57 PM
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P3220209_Large_.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92280)


https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2869/33438235422_7188014d44_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SWPGqo)Black Headed Gull on a mission (https://flic.kr/p/SWPGqo) by Mark Johnson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/133688957@N08/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3856/33594546305_31dbab2ab3_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TbCQcB)Pair of Woodies (https://flic.kr/p/TbCQcB) by Mark Johnson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/133688957@N08/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3841/33594546265_fdc83cfba8_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TbCQbV)Mr Robin (https://flic.kr/p/TbCQbV) by Mark Johnson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/133688957@N08/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2869/33438235422_7188014d44_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SWPGqo)Black Headed Gull on a mission (https://flic.kr/p/SWPGqo) by Mark Johnson (https://www.flickr.com/photos/133688957@N08/), on Flickr

First day out with the new toy. Reasonably pleased with results........

More practice and study needed.....

c12402
22nd March 2017, 10:11 PM
Nice shots, you can certainly enjoy! I'm still passing through the learning curve of this camera the same way, after three birding sessions I can see the improvements in the photos. As the camera is the very same, it's clear where is the need for improvement...


https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3696/33397629511_d039b2dd22_k.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/33397629511/)_3181132_DxO (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/33397629511/) by c12402 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/), on Flickr

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3666/33528463335_be30cba763_k.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/33528463335/)_3170402_DxO (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/33528463335/) by c12402 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/familia_guerrero/), on Flickr

blu-by-u
23rd March 2017, 02:11 AM
Ok, I forgot that factory reset the day I collected the camera. I think I need to do that.

Those shots Walti, shows the AF working well.

I think it's that lens reset. I cannot remember if mine was still at default.

The settings were the same in the mk1. Only thing I keep getting on the mk2 is the lens keep refocusing. Unlike the mk1, the focus don't move as much.

I do agree it could be me error but I can't seem to find where that error is.

Bob Barger
23rd March 2017, 11:47 AM
Nice shots, you can certainly enjoy! I'm still passing through the learning curve of this camera the same way, after three birding sessions I can see the improvements in the photos. As the camera is the very same, it's clear where is the need for

Wow, that robin shot is absolutely amazing, well done!!

c12402
23rd March 2017, 05:17 PM
Wow, that robin shot is absolutely amazing, well done!!

In reality, that robin resulted a very good actor, just look another nice water effect from the same bird...

https://flic.kr/p/RQKXq6

DavyG
23rd March 2017, 07:03 PM
I'm just relieved that I've gone from a place where I thought I'd made a massive mistake with the camera to actually thinking there is an improvement over the MKi - yesterday was VERY worrying!

PRO capture and high res are on the menu for investigation!

Good to hear that you're resolving the issues you had Walti.

I'm sure you'll be delighted with the Mark II, it does perform well.

I'm still learning but have been happy with the results so far:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3843/32794771953_14e6d4582b_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/RXXM9D)Red Kite (https://flic.kr/p/RXXM9D) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3670/33464497391_8172694bae_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SZ9ibX)Crested Tit (https://flic.kr/p/SZ9ibX) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2816/33434345202_5e1e896cb1_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SWtKZC)Robin (https://flic.kr/p/SWtKZC) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3790/32747357924_27a976b85f_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/RTLLBo)Chaffinch (https://flic.kr/p/RTLLBo) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3842/33589186315_926f53657b_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TbamRZ)Coal Tit (https://flic.kr/p/TbamRZ) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2832/32756094593_07549c2fa3_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/RUxxHB)Turnstone (https://flic.kr/p/RUxxHB) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

I look forward to seeing more of your images.

Dave

Zuiko
23rd March 2017, 08:18 PM
Absolutely love the turnstone. *chr

DavyG
23rd March 2017, 09:14 PM
Absolutely love the turnstone. *chr

Thanks John, I'm glad you like it.

Here's another from the same sequence, cropped a tad tighter.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/615/33266986021_8da6347b68_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SFFZWv)Turnstone (https://flic.kr/p/SFFZWv) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

Dave

Zuiko
23rd March 2017, 09:59 PM
Thanks John, I'm glad you like it.

Here's another from the same sequence, cropped a tad tighter.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/615/33266986021_8da6347b68_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SFFZWv)Turnstone (https://flic.kr/p/SFFZWv) by David Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/), on Flickr

Dave

that's beautiful, but I prefer the composition of the first.

DavyG
24th March 2017, 05:06 PM
that's beautiful, but I prefer the composition of the first.

I agree John, I do like the detail in the second though.

Dave

pdk42
24th March 2017, 05:33 PM
I've not so far had a lot time with the mk ii on longer lenses where more critical focus is needed. However, I did today give my old 50-200 non-SWD (+TC) a run in the garden snapping various things that took my eye. The AF worked superbly. It hardly missed a shot and moreover with the focus limiter it's completely stopped the lens racking back and forth through its range - something that happened a lot with the mk i and which essentially made it useless for serious moving target photography.

In fact, the mk ii has given the 50-200 a new lease of life. It's a fantastic optic really. With the TC it's a 70-283 f4.0-f4.9 lens and it performs superbly even wide open. Here's a few shots as examples - not great art or BIF I know, but hopefully a taste of the 50-200.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3932/33626238295_4826b17aa3_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Terg8e)
New Buds (https://flic.kr/p/Terg8e) by Paul Kaye (https://www.flickr.com/photos/paul_kaye/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3782/33497121451_4080ff4358_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/T32vbK)
Crystal Sphere (https://flic.kr/p/T32vbK) by Paul Kaye (https://www.flickr.com/photos/paul_kaye/), on Flickr

Olybirder
24th March 2017, 05:51 PM
That is very interesting Paul. I have to admit that I had overlooked the usefulness of the focus limiter when used with the 50-200. I look forward to seeing some more of your shots taken with the Mk II and that lens. A slightly more challenging subject would be good. :)

Ron

blu-by-u
27th March 2017, 01:58 AM
I did a camera reset. (actually x2) as suggested by Graham_of_Rainham

Have you checked the RLS Priority settings for S-AF & C-AF? (See Cog C1).
Also AF Limiter - Priority Release (See Cog A1) - if you're using the AF-Limiter functions.
If these items are set to "On" - the shutter can be fired even though AF confirmation has not occurred.
Did this as suggested. Noticed that even if you are not using the limiter, that Fire even if not is focus seems independent of the RLS Priority. So I switched it to OFF.

Not sure this case is connected with the discussion, but just in case it may help....

One major enhancement to my focus rate was to set lens reset parameter to OFF (default is ON). The issue is that in the time lapse between one bird and the next, the camera frecuently enters in idle mode, and this mode reset the lens forcing it to refocus the scene, making useless to pre-focus at a given place where you are expecting the bird to stop.

I was previously assuming that this reset happens when camera is switched off, but it also happens when entering in Low power modes.
...

And I set that Lens reset to OFF.

:cool::D Very happy man now. the camera seems to be working as the mk1 in all.

What I have not found out is why it was behaving so badly before the reset even when the RLS Priority, the Fire even if not in focus and the lens reset was correct. What else could have made the camera behave so badly :confused:.

And I feel so silly :o that I did not reset the camera when I first married it.

blu-by-u
4th April 2017, 05:02 AM
Is there any selection for P-AF (Phase) or C-AF (contrast)?

pdk42
4th April 2017, 07:21 AM
Is there any selection for P-AF (Phase) or C-AF (contrast)?

Not so far as I know. My suspicion is that it uses PDAF if at all possible.

Walti
4th April 2017, 07:44 AM
Not so far as I know. My suspicion is that it uses PDAF if at all possible.

From this little table on the Aus site:

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1990/PDAF.jpeg

I'm guessing it works like the MKi seems to and used the CDAF to select the target then PDAF to keep it in focus, what I haven't worked out yet is whether it only uses the PDAF cross sensors associated with the original target area selected, or switches to all PDAF points - which is how the MKi appeared to work.... (The MKi appeared to switch to the whole double cross area when using PDAF)

bassman
4th April 2017, 06:39 PM
I've been following this thread, in silence but not suffering, from blu-by-u's original post. What grabbed my attention was the mention of the Green rectangle and it's the one thing I've struggled with in (S-AF), photographing small or distant subjects. Really enjoying how C-AF works, with all the variations in focus points and had some very encouraging results.

blu-by-u
6th April 2017, 01:57 AM
I've been following this thread, in silence but not suffering, from blu-by-u's original post. What grabbed my attention was the mention of the Green rectangle and it's the one thing I've struggled with in (S-AF), photographing small or distant subjects. Really enjoying how C-AF works, with all the variations in focus points and had some very encouraging results.

Ever since the mention of it using both Contrast and Phase and the lack of the smaller AF triangle, I have been assuming the pin point to me roughly the middle of that rectangle.

Have not tested how accurate the AF is in macro.

What's the problem are you encountering with the rectangle? I have been using single AF point. Have not found that multiple AF to work for me and also I have forgotten :eek: how to turn on that Predictive AF.:D

Maria
6th April 2017, 07:15 AM
Ever since the mention of it using both Contrast and Phase and the lack of the smaller AF triangle, I have been assuming the pin point to me roughly the middle of that rectangle.

Have not tested how accurate the AF is in macro.



Have you tried Super Spot AF - described on page 41 of the EM1 MkII manual. You appear to have to assign it to a function button to be able to use it. Seems a bit complicated at first but should be useful once you get the hang of it - might be easier to test out when using a tripod.

From the manual:

Zoom frame AF/Zoom AF ( Super Spot AF)

You can zoom in on a portion of the frame when adjusting focus. Choosing a high zoom ratio allows you to use autofocus to focus on a smaller area than is normally covered by the AF target. You can also position the focus target more precisely.

bassman
6th April 2017, 08:27 PM
Really appreciate the replies and thanks to someone's post, in a previous thread, I found you could adjust the size of the AF target (p.35 in the manual). My Fn2 button was set to magnify and purely by chance I discovered that it would change the AF target. Press once : changes from the Green rectangle to a smaller target area, whilst remaining in full image view, found immediate improvement ! press Fn2 again : fantastically small target area !! ( size adjustable via front/rear wheel) Press OK button : will return you back to the original rectangle AF target. Thanks Maria, I discovered p.41 of the manual, only last evening ... not wanting to look silly, thought I'd better check the manual before posting and your mention of a tripod very relevant. That 'Super Spot' AF target, is amazing but when I was about to photograph my very first Kingfisher, (40-150mm 2.8 + 1.4x converter, with tripod) shaking with excitement..lol), working at 14x magnification and not seeing the whole frame, was extremely difficult. I know this is all very subject dependant and this camera is easily capable of focusing on very small area. Without losing any existing features, in a future firmware update, I'd love Olympus to give the MKII a super small AF target, in the full frame EVF.


...... Mark

bassman
6th April 2017, 10:40 PM
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/506/P3263344_1.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92525)

My first Kingfisher - Strumpshaw Fen, Norfolk ... 40-150mm 2.8 + MC-14 (approx. 100% crop) From my above post, meant to say 'without tripod' but camera supported from within bird hide.

GyRob
7th April 2017, 08:55 AM
Hi All
I am new to Olympus so early days yet but I am quite pleased with the camera and the 300f4 pro but I do need to find the settings that work for me focus is super fast but I do need to work on the "lose / tight " along with single point or 5 this is how I use my Canon .
The main different seems to be the Canon only uses the surrounding points If the centre one cant pick the target up.

The Olympus seems to jump to any of the 5 regardless .
Rob.

GyRob
8th April 2017, 09:06 PM
Got out tonight and found a shorty 300f4pro 1/2000 f4 iso 400
Rob.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2036/P4080268--SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92566)

GyRob
8th April 2017, 10:01 PM
Well this camera in silent is as good as it gets, twice now I have had an owl fly right past me as I was pressing the shutter and they just don't veer off they just keep coming .
I'm not use to that as my main gear is a 1dxmkII and 600f4 isL mkII and it scares the H..L out of birds .
I'm still learning with the OMD mkII but I'm blown away with this silent shutter I'm also happy with the iq 400 to 800 iso is my comfort zone that's just me though .
Rob.

Greytop
8th April 2017, 10:17 PM
Just seen this on TP too, very impressive Robert.

Phill D
9th April 2017, 07:38 AM
Superb shot Rob, I bet you are still smiling.

blu-by-u
10th April 2017, 02:52 AM
Have you tried Super Spot AF - described on page 41 of the EM1 MkII manual. You appear to have to assign it to a function button to be able to use it. Seems a bit complicated at first but should be useful once you get the hang of it - might be easier to test out when using a tripod.

From the manual:

Zoom frame AF/Zoom AF ( Super Spot AF)

You can zoom in on a portion of the frame when adjusting focus. Choosing a high zoom ratio allows you to use autofocus to focus on a smaller area than is normally covered by the AF target. You can also position the focus target more precisely.

:rolleyes: Unless I am doing something wrong, the "Super Spot AF" seems the same as the Single AF. The size of the rectangle can only go bigger but not smaller than the Single AF rectangular even if it's x14.

GyRob
10th April 2017, 03:15 PM
Yes smiling thanks guy's .
Have the 40 to 150 and 1.4tc coming tomorrow so should be set for my birding needs .

Regarding focus accuracy it really is good very good, in a burst some can be just a little off but as the camera is so quick it will often re-acquire focus lose then re- acquire of cause most of this is me losing the bird but you do end up with some really sharp ones so as long as you can get onto the bird early enough your in with a great chance .
I'm talking BIF here .
Rob.

c12402
10th April 2017, 11:26 PM
I've been told by an Olympus 'evangelist' that C1 as it comes from factory settings, was the recommended mode for BIF by Olympus the first time they were invited to test the new model.

It does not mean that it cannot be improved with additional tweaks, just it is the recommended starting point.

I'll try next Wednesday I have a hide session for eagles. I'll let you know.

TonyR
11th April 2017, 07:44 AM
I've been told by an Olympus 'evangelist' that C1 as it comes from factory settings, was the recommended mode for BIF by Olympus the first time they were invited to test the new model.

It does not mean that it cannot be improved with additional tweaks, just it is the recommended starting point.

I'll try next Wednesday I have a hide session for eagles. I'll let you know.

It's interesting looking at the default settings for the custom modes in that none of them vary AF Lock. Presumably, it is left at 0. The differneces mainly affect drive mode, AF mode and AF area.

Gwyver
11th April 2017, 04:21 PM
Just my opinion, but I think the Custom Mode settings were designed so that sales staff in camera retailers could easily demonstrate the M1M2's "gee whizz" features such as Pro-Capture, 60fps, etc..
I doubt that anyone intentionally shooting BIF or similar would leave the drive mode set as "P".

c12402
11th April 2017, 04:57 PM
Yes, probably it's intended as the first approximation to different types of shooting, needing an additional customized setup anyway.

They received that recommendation to start shootings without any prior knowledge on the new camera so... that's normal in my view.

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 07:28 AM
I've just been out and fired off 300 photos, with the MKi I would have got a far better hit rate than I have so far with the MKii.

My head was telling me to do the test and wow before buying, and my conclusions so far is that if I had done so I wouldn't have bought it!

I need to stop and seriously look at the results and try and understand why I am so disappointed with them so far!

I agree with you regarding focus.... I have been very disappointed with the focus accuracy of the E-M1 MK2 for birds in flight. I use the Lumix 100-400 and the Oly 40-150 f2.8 with a 1.4x teleconvertor. Set up for back button focus (thumb focus as known in Japan). The success rate is appalling if I shoot 400-500 pictures I'll be lucky if 10 of them are made f the quality I expec form a systems such as this. It's shocking!! Previously I owned an Olympus E-M 5 then an E-M1 then an E-M 5 MK2 so I'm no stranger to Olympus systems. Problem with all of them was they were rubbish for consistent BIF photography. So I decided to trade in for a Canon 7D MK2, which was excellent and provided tack sharp continuous focus images, but I found a bit noisy on ISO side of things. So traded up to the Nikon D750 with Sigma 150-600mm which whilst slower 6 fps was spot on accurate for BIF and the ISO noise levels were outstanding. I decided I wanted something smaller and the E-M1 MK2 was out boasting super fast focus (true) super amazing stabilisation (true) great CAF great for fast moving objects like BIF (not true). So unless I can get it working correctly in the next few days the whole lot is being sold for the Nikon D500 and 200-500mm it's much bigger... but there's no point having something small, compact easy to carry if it can't deliver what I need. I should add for non moving birds it's fine no problem, but BIF forget it.

TonyR
14th April 2017, 07:45 AM
I agree with you regarding focus.... I have been very disappointed with the focus accuracy of the E-M1 MK2 for birds in flight. I use the Lumix 100-400 and the Oly 40-150 f2.8 with a 1.4x teleconvertor. Set up for back button focus (thumb focus as known in Japan). The success rate is appalling if I shoot 400-500 pictures I'll be lucky if 10 of them are made f the quality I expec form a systems such as this. It's shocking!! Previously I owned an Olympus E-M 5 then an E-M1 then an E-M 5 MK2 so I'm no stranger to Olympus systems. Problem with all of them was they were rubbish for consistent BIF photography. So I decided to trade in for a Canon 7D MK2, which was excellent and provided tack sharp continuous focus images, but I found a bit noisy on ISO side of things. So traded up to the Nikon D750 with Sigma 150-600mm which whilst slower 6 fps was spot on accurate for BIF and the ISO noise levels were outstanding. I decided I wanted something smaller and the E-M1 MK2 was out boasting super fast focus (true) super amazing stabilisation (true) great CAF great for fast moving objects like BIF (not true). So unless I can get it working correctly in the next few days the whole lot is being sold for the Nikon D500 and 200-500mm it's much bigger... but there's no point having something small, compact easy to carry if it can't deliver what I need. I should add for non moving birds it's fine no problem, but BIF forget it.

Well, you are doing something wrong! Can you tell us what settings you are using for your BIF photos and then we might be able to help. First of all, are you using Sequential-H? Because that doesn't do continuous AF.

Here's a couple of mine.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2020108_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92699)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022095_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92700)

wornish
14th April 2017, 08:09 AM
I agree with you regarding focus.... I have been very disappointed with the focus accuracy of the E-M1 MK2 for birds in flight. I use the Lumix 100-400 and the Oly 40-150 f2.8 with a 1.4x teleconvertor. Set up for back button focus (thumb focus as known in Japan). The success rate is appalling if I shoot 400-500 pictures I'll be lucky if 10 of them are made f the quality I expec form a systems such as this. It's shocking!! Previously I owned an Olympus E-M 5 then an E-M1 then an E-M 5 MK2 so I'm no stranger to Olympus systems. Problem with all of them was they were rubbish for consistent BIF photography. So I decided to trade in for a Canon 7D MK2, which was excellent and provided tack sharp continuous focus images, but I found a bit noisy on ISO side of things. So traded up to the Nikon D750 with Sigma 150-600mm which whilst slower 6 fps was spot on accurate for BIF and the ISO noise levels were outstanding. I decided I wanted something smaller and the E-M1 MK2 was out boasting super fast focus (true) super amazing stabilisation (true) great CAF great for fast moving objects like BIF (not true). So unless I can get it working correctly in the next few days the whole lot is being sold for the Nikon D500 and 200-500mm it's much bigger... but there's no point having something small, compact easy to carry if it can't deliver what I need. I should add for non moving birds it's fine no problem, but BIF forget it.

Hmmm, somethings not right here, mine works great. I don't care if I get 15% keepers out of a stream of shots - its a digital camera not film, so I just delete the not ideal ones, it costs nothing.

I have C3 set up as my bird in flight mode for quick access. Of course the noise levels are not as low as a full frame camera thats a well known issue because of sensor size. But its well within acceptable limits, that said I don't shoot bats in caves ;)

For me the key trade off is weight. A smaller sensor means smaller lenses and much less weight. My back didn't enjoy carrying around 5+ kg of gear plus a tripod and gimble head to get bird in flight shots and found myself not taking the camera out as often. Now I can simply shoot hand held and the whole thing weighs about 2kg.

If all you do is BIF and you have strong arms then perhaps a DSLR with its dedicated focus technology is still the gold standard but as always there is a cost.

BreezeG
14th April 2017, 08:30 AM
I agree with you regarding focus.... I have been very disappointed with the focus accuracy of the E-M1 MK2 for birds in flight. I use the Lumix 100-400 and the Oly 40-150 f2.8 with a 1.4x teleconvertor. Set up for back button focus (thumb focus as known in Japan). The success rate is appalling if I shoot 400-500 pictures I'll be lucky if 10 of them are made f the quality I expec form a systems such as this. It's shocking!! Previously I owned an Olympus E-M 5 then an E-M1 then an E-M 5 MK2 so I'm no stranger to Olympus systems. Problem with all of them was they were rubbish for consistent BIF photography. So I decided to trade in for a Canon 7D MK2, which was excellent and provided tack sharp continuous focus images, but I found a bit noisy on ISO side of things. So traded up to the Nikon D750 with Sigma 150-600mm which whilst slower 6 fps was spot on accurate for BIF and the ISO noise levels were outstanding. I decided I wanted something smaller and the E-M1 MK2 was out boasting super fast focus (true) super amazing stabilisation (true) great CAF great for fast moving objects like BIF (not true). So unless I can get it working correctly in the next few days the whole lot is being sold for the Nikon D500 and 200-500mm it's much bigger... but there's no point having something small, compact easy to carry if it can't deliver what I need. I should add for non moving birds it's fine no problem, but BIF forget it.
I love my Om1ii for general stuff but having just bought the 100-400 lens I have to agree that for birds in flight, the camera is pants. Hopefully Olympus may be able to improve things with firmware upgrades but Im thankful that I kept my D500 and Nikkor 80-400.
For those stating that their camera is brilliant and then quoting a 15% keeper rate, thats plain daft. So 85% of your BIF images are useless but the camera performs great? Really?
I am going to persevere as Im sure there is a large learning curve but I wont be selling the D500 anytime soon.

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 09:11 AM
I love my Om1ii for general stuff but having just bought the 100-400 lens I have to agree that for birds in flight, the camera is pants. Hopefully Olympus may be able to improve things with firmware upgrades but Im thankful that I kept my D500 and Nikkor 80-400.
For those stating that their camera is brilliant and then quoting a 15% keeper rate, thats plain daft. So 85% of your BIF images are useless but the camera performs great? Really?
I am going to persevere as Im sure there is a large learning curve but I wont be selling the D500 anytime soon.

Glad to see I'm not the only one... I can't spend anymore time on this useless system, I have given it 2 months of experimentation already tried so many different combinations of settings to no avail. Quite frankly for a camera that costs considerably more than the Nikon D500 it should be amazing, but alas they have spent so much time on the trying to wow us with the technology they forgot it's about the picture quality. I am guessing only a small number of users will configure 10-15% of the settings, rather than delivering a product that DSLR manufacturers would see as a true rival. As for the ISO noise, I am lost for words when I watch these reviews and they go on about how useable the camera is at any thing above 800 ISO and even above 16000 ISO, I think they need to go Specsavers!. I find the noise levels totally unacceptable even at 400 ISO.

wornish
14th April 2017, 09:11 AM
This topic is click bait - which I fell for. Noticed the critic has only posted the one post on here, think its a wind up. He just posted the second as I was typing this.

I have seen the exact same subject come up on many other forums with fan boys from different camps arguing their point.

If the camera works for you then great if it doesn't then buy a different one. End of story.

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 09:21 AM
Well, you are doing something wrong! Can you tell us what settings you are using for your BIF photos and then we might be able to help. First of all, are you using Sequential-H? Because that doesn't do continuous AF.

Here's a couple of mine.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2020108_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92699)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022095_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92700)

I agree they a couple of nice shots. Would be kind enough to provide with details of the settings you have used, I would like to try them out over the weekend and see if it works.

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 09:22 AM
This topic is click bait - which I fell for. Noticed the critic has only posted the one post on here, think its a wind up. He just posted the second as I was typing this.

I have seen the exact same subject come up on many other forums with fan boys from different camps arguing their point.

If the camera works for you then great if it doesn't then buy a different one. End of story.

Dave this is not click bait whatever that is... I am a genuine owner and if possible would like to get it working. Regards Tony

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 09:44 AM
This topic is click bait - which I fell for. Noticed the critic has only posted the one post on here, think its a wind up. He just posted the second as I was typing this.

I have seen the exact same subject come up on many other forums with fan boys from different camps arguing their point.

If the camera works for you then great if it doesn't then buy a different one. End of story.

I find your last comment quite rude... and not very helpful at all

"If the camera works for you then great if it doesn't then buy a different one. End of story"

presumably when you originally joined the forum you also only had a single posting!

art frames
14th April 2017, 10:20 AM
I find your last comment quite rude... and not very helpful at all

"If the camera works for you then great if it doesn't then buy a different one. End of story"

presumably when you originally joined the forum you also only had a single posting!

I quite agree. I have been here since the start and do not find your comment worthy of the response. I feel that people should see and hear about all sides to any camera.

I had a similar rough ride when the EM1 came out. I had real problems and was 'told' I was wrong. And yet the very things I took up with Olympus as significant issues after trying three cameras (and which were not initially accepted - focus issues and shutter shock) were eventually 'solved' by Oly Japan with new features and upgrades to the system software. I didn't re-try the updated machine mainly because of Olympus's attitude to me direct (which was unforgivable from any business).

I have owned Olympus cameras for 40 years and currently own six. I also own one Canon (because my son said I should). He was right and I am delighted with my abilities to get fast focus on wildlife with it (not me, no fancy settings, just as it comes). I still like Olympus cameras for other things and no system can do everything.

I personally would want to hear the unvarnished truth. It is a great deal of money to spend and once you have bought it Olympus will not offer you your money back. Even when you prove them wrong.

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 10:35 AM
Ok, looking on another Olympus forum I have noted when using the Lumix 100-400 and using both IBIS and Lens OS iis not advisable as they work against each other creating the effect of no stablisation. The suggestion is to turn off IBIS and only use the lens OS.

I am wondering if that is what has casued the problem, I am off out to try this and see what happens.

Will provide update on my return, fingers crossed.

Phill D
14th April 2017, 10:47 AM
I hope this thread calms down a bit and gets back to the details. As Peter just said I too would like to hear the unvarnished truth, if that's ever really possible though as we all have some bias I guess. Honest opinions are good enough for me. I don't really think anyone here is just out to stir things up though, often typed posts and emails come out more pointed and poisonous than they are meant to just by virtue of this interactive medium. Anyway getting back to the topic details if anyone is willing to share their detailed settings and trials I'd be grateful as I've not tried any BiFs with my Mk2 yet and am keen to have a go. If as Walti says I can't do better than with the Mk1 I'll be pretty disappointed as for me I was useless at BiF with mine. So far for everything else I've done the Mk2 has been better. So fingers crossed.

wornish
14th April 2017, 10:50 AM
Dave this is not click bait whatever that is... I am a genuine owner and if possible would like to get it working. Regards Tony

Did not mean to be rude and did not intend to offend anyone, so sorry.

Having said that to come on a forum and for your very first post to say a camera is "pants" certainly gets peoples attention !

I have the EM1mk2 and with the Oly 300mm lens it focusses spot on and rapidly.
I can only suggest that perhaps if you respond to the requests from others and share your settings then people on here will try and help.

Click bait (or spamming)- is when people purposely post on forums in a controversial way to get a reaction from the members. Like posting on a Nikon forum and saying Canon is better because of x or y feature. If you look at DPReview for example it happens all the time.

Phill D
14th April 2017, 10:52 AM
Goshawk I nearly went for that lens too recently so will be very interested in your experience. I think Amanda (Mrs T) and Brian (Wadie?) on here also have it and I know Brian in particular has been using it for surfboarders pretty successfully. I'm sure they have also said that the two IS systems in this case don't work together so you have to use only one. Good luck with your BiFs.

Bengeo
14th April 2017, 10:56 AM
Ok, looking on another Olympus forum I have noted when using the Lumix 100-400 and using both IBIS and Lens OS iis not advisable as they work against each other creating the effect of no stablisation. The suggestion is to turn off IBIS and only use the lens OS.


If you have Lens IS on then the IBIS setting is not relevant as it will be turned off. If IBIS is set to on and you turn the lens IS switch to off, then IBIS will take over.

There was a problem with this lens and the EM-1 Mark 1 when panning where the lens IS got confused and the lens elements temporarily locked up. The EM-1 Mark 2 seems better, but I still switch to IBIS when panning to be safe.

mack100
14th April 2017, 11:09 AM
Glad to see I'm not the only one... I can't spend anymore time on this useless system, I have given it 2 months of experimentation already tried so many different combinations of settings to no avail. Quite frankly for a camera that costs considerably more than the Nikon D500 it should be amazing, but alas they have spent so much time on the trying to wow us with the technology they forgot it's about the picture quality. I am guessing only a small number of users will configure 10-15% of the settings, rather than delivering a product that DSLR manufacturers would see as a true rival. As for the ISO noise, I am lost for words when I watch these reviews and they go on about how useable the camera is at any thing above 800 ISO and even above 16000 ISO, I think they need to go Specsavers!. I find the noise levels totally unacceptable even at 400 ISO.
I felt the same way as you about the E-m1 Mk1, for me the AF was shocking with the 300mm F4 + 1.4 TC. My keeper rate was very low and I really considered junking the whole system for wildlife.

The E-m1 Mk11 is streets ahead and my keeper rate is comparable to my Canon system.
As far as ISO goes, I view this system in the same way as I viewed by Canon 7D when I had one. Put simply, do not use in poor light!

This new Oly body is much better than that for higher ISO (note that I do not say high ISO). I have been experimenting with auto ISO in my C2 settings for BIF, I'm still not too sure it works and for perching birds I'm not using it.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/562/32646532206_bae88b3200_b.jpg
This is at 1600 ISO and this is also at 1600 ISO:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/279/32274412472_5d6e0980c6_b.jpg

OK, there is noise and I have applied a sensible amount of NR in pp but even at 4X what you consider to be unacceptable I'm happy with this level of noise just to get the shot.
I think most of us still have a long way to go with this body to get the best out of it and I include Olympus themselves in this!

art frames
14th April 2017, 11:16 AM
Click bait - is when people purposely post on forums in a controversial way to get a reaction from the members. Like posting on a Nikon forum and saying Canon is better because of x or y feature. If you look at DPReview for example it happens all the time.

Glad to see the apology. *chr

Can I just suggest amendments your definition.

'Click bait' is specifically aimed at getting revenue by forcing "click throughs' which take you to advertising content which then takes advantage of Google's advertising model. You often see these on newspaper pages where several seeming dramatic stories eg 'what he saw on his wedding night...!' usually with a bikini clad female picture.

What you describe is normally called 'trolling' although trolling takes many other forms.

Our lives would all be improved by getting rid of both of these. And our dictionaries shortened by not having to invent new words for such tawdry behaviours.

MJ224
14th April 2017, 01:38 PM
Goshawk I nearly went for that lens too recently so will be very interested in your experience. I think Amanda (Mrs T) and Brian (Wadie?) on here also have it and I know Brian in particular has been using it for surfboarders pretty successfully. I'm sure they have also said that the two IS systems in this case don't work together so you have to use only one. Good luck with your BiFs.

I also use this combination, and have tended to use both IBIS systems switched on. Results are unpredictable, so intend to experiment.

Interesting thread. My main photo subject is bird photography, but would hate to have to change systems now............

BreezeG
14th April 2017, 03:13 PM
For everything other than birds in flight Im loving the OM1ii. I will definately persevere with BIF and hopefully things may improve but at present the hit rate isnt at all good. Im off to Spain in a couple of weeks so hopefully some settled weather with good light and an opportunity to use the camera on birds in the Ebro Delta.
Any camera system is going to take a while to settle in to and hopefully Olympus will listen to their customers and may improve the useability of the auto focus system as Im sure the hardware should be well capable of producing a decent hit rate. (A decent user guide would be really usefull too).
If not at least I have a great and lighter system for all other subjects and the D500 can come out once in a while for serious birding.

Mdb2
14th April 2017, 04:29 PM
Well, you are doing something wrong! Can you tell us what settings you are using for your BIF photos and then we might be able to help. First of all, are you using Sequential-H? Because that doesn't do continuous AF.

Here's a couple of mine.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2020108_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92699)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022095_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92700)

Hi Tony, I have just picked up under TEST AND WOW. the em1 mk2. I will be taking it back on Tuesday. I have been playing with it at home with the 300pro+ converter. Can you give me some tips please. I am not expecting miracles with the olymk2. Also I am probably spoilt with my 7d2. If I can get close to the 7d2 for BIF then I will purchase the Olympus. So far sitting outside in the garden I am a little disappointed with its not much better than my em1. Obviously the weather isn't great but it's all there is, I am going out tomorrow for the day to give it a proper go. One other quick question is what would you consider your keeper rate.
Kind regards Mike

BreezeG
14th April 2017, 04:57 PM
Tony, do you have any other shots of the Bittern or Goshawk? How many images did you capture and how many are useable please? The Bittern is almost flying away from you so I suspect you started tracking it earlier.....,did the earlier images come up to the same standard or is this similar to what Im finding....ie one or two of the series being useable compared to almost all with my Nikon gear?

TonyR
14th April 2017, 05:12 PM
I agree they a couple of nice shots. Would be kind enough to provide with details of the settings you have used, I would like to try them out over the weekend and see if it works.

Okay, first, the basic settings. I'm using a Custom set for birds in flight so that I can switch quickly to a completely different setup for static subjects. This custom set is in Manual 'M' mode with Auto Iso. I set exposure compensation to about +1 EV for bif usually. Using the 300mm (+teleconverter) I set the aperture wide open if light is limited. Otherwise, close down by half a stop for maximum sharpness. Shutter speed I like to be at least 1/2000 of a second but I will reduce this if pushed. On a really bright day, I will go to 1/3000 with this lens.

Next up, switch image stabilisation OFF. The camera expects to compensate for your motion by moving in the opposite direction. If you are panning with a bird, it will be fighting you. Sure, it is easier to track the bird with IS on but it will introduce fine blur to the images. Although you can set IS for panning, I can't predict whether the bird will fly across in front of me or directly towards me and over my head. So that setting is of no use to me.

I'm using C-AF (not C-AF + tracking 'cos it is pants). By default I am using 5-point AF area selected. However, for a very fast bird against a clear sky, I have a function button set up so that I can switch to all points quickly. The bittern shot would not have worked with all AF points selected because the bird is quite small in the frame and so the AF would almost certainly focused on the background. The AF will, in general, pick out the closest object that it can see but only if it fills a realtively large part of the frame. I find that I lose the subject with single point AF and 9-point does not seem to offer any advantages over 5 so, 5-point is what I use.

For drive mode, I am using Sequential L silent shutter with the frame rate set to 15 frames per second. You could equally use Sequential L with mechanical shutter. I find the rolling shutter effects with silent shutter to be pretty minimal but I would switch to mechanical shutter if panning against a background with strong verticals. Note that Sequential H modes only focus once for the first shot even if you have C-AF selected. In other words, it behaves just like S-AF.

Then for other camera settings. I have C-AF Lock set to +1. Still testing this but I find this settings seems best for bif. I have AF Area Pointer set to On2 so that when I am using all AF points, I can see the selected points. I have Release Priority C set to On so that the camera will start taking pictures before AF is confirmed. This means the first shot may be out of focus but, at 15 fps, the second one will be along soon!

I think that's it for the settings that will make a difference. Of course, you need to keep the selected focus points on the bird but, if you do, you should get some decent pictures.

I process my files from raw using Adobe Camera Raw. Then in photoshop, I use the Neat Image plug-in for noise reduction and then a little bit of Smart Sharpen before saving the jpeg. Note that the images I have posted have been reduced in size and saved with high compression to meet the file size requirements of this web site.

I will easily take 1000 images when I am out birding for the day. Of these, about half will be of good technical quality. Of the half that are not good quality, a lot will be because of my mistakes. E.g. poor tracking, wrong custom set selected, wrong AF points selected, wrong exposure compensation etc. From the good half, I select the images I like and would expect to keep maybe 50 for the day. So 5%. But that's mainly down to the (lack of) skill of the photographer or what the subject happened to be doing, not the capabilities of the camera.

TonyR
14th April 2017, 05:14 PM
Hi Tony, I have just picked up under TEST AND WOW. the em1 mk2. I will be taking it back on Tuesday. I have been playing with it at home with the 300pro+ converter. Can you give me some tips please. I am not expecting miracles with the olymk2. Also I am probably spoilt with my 7d2. If I can get close to the 7d2 for BIF then I will purchase the Olympus. So far sitting outside in the garden I am a little disappointed with its not much better than my em1. Obviously the weather isn't great but it's all there is, I am going out tomorrow for the day to give it a proper go. One other quick question is what would you consider your keeper rate.
Kind regards Mike

Hopefully my post above to Goshawk will answer that.

TonyR
14th April 2017, 05:29 PM
Tony, do you have any other shots of the Bittern or Goshawk? How many images did you capture and how many are useable please? The Bittern is almost flying away from you so I suspect you started tracking it earlier.....,did the earlier images come up to the same standard or is this similar to what Im finding....ie one or two of the series being useable compared to almost all with my Nikon gear?

Well, you're right. My wife spotted the bitttern just st it was disappearing behind some trees. However, knowing the direction it was flying, I guessed where it would reappear and managed to fire off three short bursts (at 15fps). The first burst was good. For the second burst, I missed the bird with all my AF points and focused on the background but managed to recover and nail it with the third burst.

I kept three images from the first and third bursts, mainly choosing based on what the wing position was like and could I see the head and eye. The image I posted above was from the first burst and is numbered xxx95. The other two images are from the third burst and are numbered xxx111 and xxx113. So, about one second later (most lost in the second burst).

I'm not sure how many I took altogether, probably three bursts of ten. Most of the first and last bursts were technically okay. I kept the best three. I didn't really want any more than that because, with the bird flying away from me, they are not the most interesting shots.

The closest shot, the first one, is over 100m away. The last shot is over 140m away. All are rather heavy crops as a result. But, as you don't see a bittern that often, you take what you can get!

Here's all three that I kept.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022095_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92700)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022111_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92715)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2022113_s.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92716)

TonyR
14th April 2017, 05:42 PM
While we are on the subject of AF abilty, here is a rough idea of what the E-M1 MkII will do with all AF points selected.

The following two images are adjacent shots from a burst of a small bird I saw flying very fast towards me. It turned out to be a goldcrest which, I think, is the UK's smallest bird. Even with 420mm attached, it was very small in the frame (so huge crops) and I only kept the images because it turned out to be a goldcrest. They are not very good quality and I know I could do better if I had been trying. But, this camera is not pants!

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2021217.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92717)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P2021218.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92718)

BreezeG
14th April 2017, 05:53 PM
Thanks very much for all of that Tony. I am set up exactly the same except for the shutter speeds (Due to using the 100-400 with subsequently less available light) and C-AF lock which Ive been trying at different settings. Your images give me the confidence I need to spend a good deal more time experimenting.
The camera is new and there isnt much in the way of guidance from practitiomers so those posts are really valuable....Thanks again.

Mdb2
14th April 2017, 06:34 PM
Hopefully my post above to Goshawk will answer that.

Thanks tony, I will try the settings tomorrow.
Kind regards Mike

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 08:58 PM
Hi All,

Firstly I want to apologise for slating the camera and lens blaming the equipment. When it was my misunderstanding of the way in which the EM1 MK2 operates. I did go out and take many photos without IBIS turned on using only the OS of the Lumix 100-400 lens.. There was a lack of flying birds/ducks, managed to find a few. I also used 1250 - 2000 ISO which I ran through Neat Image, providing minimal noise reduction required to improve the image and sharpened some of the pictures. What a difference, I will now also try tomorrow the settings that TonyR has suggested.

Will post a few photos up, It feels so good that I can now actually take BIF and static bird photos where I can be confident that a very high percentage are in focus and once I implement the settings TonyR has documented I should get an even higher percentage of keepers.

Thanks to all for your suggestions

I have tried to upload an image, being asked for the HTTP:// where the image is located, is it not possible to browse to hard drive to upload image?

PeterBirder
14th April 2017, 09:38 PM
I have tried to upload an image, being asked for the HTTP:// where the image is located, is it not possible to browse to hard drive to upload image?


You need to upload your images to your gallery space on the site first.

On the site Homepage you will find two video tutorials on how to upload and how to include uploaded images in your posts.

You will need to re-size images to 1000 X 750 pixels or so and adjust the JPEG compression (quality) to get a file size of less than 500Kb.

Regards.*chr

Goshawk
14th April 2017, 10:43 PM
You need to upload your images to your gallery space on the site first.

On the site Homepage you will find two video tutorials on how to upload and how to include uploaded images in your posts.

You will need to re-size images to 1000 X 750 pixels or so and adjust the JPEG compression (quality) to get a file size of less than 500Kb.

Regards.*chr


Many thanks

Tony

TonyR
15th April 2017, 08:24 AM
Hi All,

Firstly I want to apologise for slating the camera and lens blaming the equipment. When it was my misunderstanding of the way in which the EM1 MK2 operates. I did go out and take many photos without IBIS turned on using only the OS of the Lumix 100-400 lens.. There was a lack of flying birds/ducks, managed to find a few. I also used 1250 - 2000 ISO which I ran through Neat Image, providing minimal noise reduction required to improve the image and sharpened some of the pictures. What a difference, I will now also try tomorrow the settings that TonyR has suggested.

Will post a few photos up, It feels so good that I can now actually take BIF and static bird photos where I can be confident that a very high percentage are in focus and once I implement the settings TonyR has documented I should get an even higher percentage of keepers.

Thanks to all for your suggestions

I have tried to upload an image, being asked for the HTTP:// where the image is located, is it not possible to browse to hard drive to upload image?


Good. Glad you are having some success now *chr.

We are all still learning as this camera is still relatively new to everyone so I wouldn't take my settings as definitive but they should be a good place to start. Looking forward to seeing some of your pics.

GyRob
15th April 2017, 08:35 AM
My settings are very close to TonyR same lens too but I do uses stabilisation and at the moment +2 on the lock ,I also set everything so M mode is for me.

I'm only testing CAF as I'm hoping its good enough for a static shot too and up till now it is indeed working very well, of cause not every shot is sharp but like Tony there are always a few that has everything right and with birds that's not to easy .
very happy with the setup.
Rob.

wornish
15th April 2017, 09:42 AM
You might want to listen to what Scott Bourne says about his experience of shooting the E-M1 Mk2 against his pro Canon gear.

https://photofocus.com/2017/03/31/photofocus-podcast-mirrorless-with-scott-bourne-marco-larousse/

He's since sold all his Canon gear and gone over completely to micro 4/3rds.

Thanks for sharing the Link

MJ224
16th April 2017, 08:28 AM
I found that the IBIS setting was at the default of a 9mm lens.

How much would that affect its operation?

Its not an easy setting to change, so I have made it 200mm, as an overall average between my 400mm pany and 12mm Zuiko.

Mj

wornish
16th April 2017, 09:12 AM
Here's another, earlier podcast where Scott talks about his experience of shooting with e E-M1 Mk2. Skip to around 27 minutes in.

https://soundcloud.com/photofocus/the-mirrorless-show-photofocus-podcast-january-28-2017

The section starting around 27mins is really worth listening to. Thanks for posting. I personally think it answers a lot of the questions being raised in this thread.

He also says there is no one answer to the settings it depends on the circumstances which makes sense to me.

Greytop
16th April 2017, 09:14 AM
I found that the IBIS setting was at the default of a 9mm lens.

How much would that affect its operation?

Its not an easy setting to change, so I have made it 200mm, as an overall average between my 400mm pany and 12mm Zuiko.

Mj

Hi Mark, the setting you have changed is for the focal length of a manual lens. i.e. where the camera has no way of knowing what the focal length is.
The image stabilisation is set automatically to the right focal length for micro 4/3rds autofocus lenses.

Goshawk
16th April 2017, 09:49 AM
All
Thanks to all for your suggestions thus far. I went out and took some photos of birds in flight (well Herons to be exact) and rapid moving Red Squirrels.



Used the settings that have been suggested on the whole I am extremely pleased with the results. I will have to do some fine tuning to find optimum for various scenarios.



At least now I have a great baseline to start from.



Have included 3 examples of many (which are sharp and in focus using the Olympus 40-150mm F/4 and 1.4x. I also have some other shots taken with the Lumix 100-400 that are equally sharp and in focus.



The difference is light and day. The Olympus E-M1 MK2 system does need some time invested to get to used to. I am also happy using the higher ISO settings up to ISO 3200 thus far.



I said I would never use above ISO 400 in my previous comments as I didnít feel it was good enough, I retract that statement and can confirm now that I have sharp in focus images the ISO noise is acceptable and even up to ISO 3200 running them through Neat Image with small amount of adjustment they are very useable.



Will post some additional non BIF images later.


http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2038/thumbs/Heron_Forum-2.jpg (http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=92738)

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2038/thumbs/Heron_Forum_-3.jpg (http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=92739)

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2038/thumbs/Heron_Forum_01-2.jpg (http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=92737)

wornish
16th April 2017, 09:51 AM
Glad you got there, great images.

blu-by-u
17th April 2017, 01:09 AM
Unlike the mk1, this mk2 is not an easy beast to train.

GyRob
18th April 2017, 09:06 PM
One from tonight but a bit too far away really this was with 5 points I did try one but could not keep on the bird tracking was set at +1 I think I will try 0 midway next time .
I thought I had this worked out but lot's in focus lot's close and lot's out of focus I think it was more to do with the light tonight so more work to do .
Rob.
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P4180206--SMALL1.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92769)

Goshawk
18th April 2017, 09:50 PM
One from tonight but a bit too far away really this was with 5 points I did try one but could not keep on the bird tracking was set at +1 I think I will try 0 midway next time .
I thought I had this worked out but lot's in focus lot's close and lot's out of focus I think it was more to do with the light tonight so more work to do .
Rob.
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P4180206--SMALL1.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/92769)

That's a nice shot. So far for me what has worked best is switching between 9 and all foucus points activated and lens speed set to +2, although I can't say that either is best as still experimenting, I find I am switching between them as I shoot.

GyRob
19th April 2017, 08:31 AM
Yes I get the feeling like my Canon gear for birds there is not one magic setting .
It's finding One that works for most situations and adjust from there .
One thing I do know is the silent shutter will get shots of birds my canon's will never get,
I must add that is in Good light .
Rob.

Goshawk
1st May 2017, 12:09 PM
I have been doing some additional testing and can say that I am now getting many more keepers. I think my biggest problem is that I imagined having a top of the range DSLR would provide me with many many more keepers than the EM1 MK2. I will say that initially I was disappointed with the EM1 MK2, but now realise it was not the camera but my lack of understanding impatience of spending time to learn about it. So what has now changed my mind that top DSLRs from Canon or Nikon can also give a high percentage of non keepers. It was a talk I attended over the weekend given by Andy Rouse who admitted that he also gets many images that are not as sharp as he would like or not in focus. As we know he uses canon body and lens combinations that costs as much as a new good family saloon car ( he probably dosen't buy them and I suspect they are provided by Canon) non the less, the point is he also experiences similar problems. What he does get is probably cleaner images as he uses full frame, that said I would imagine that in most circumstances the EM1 MK2 can hold its own against the big guns. I must say that I have gone from getting to a point of really hating the EM1 MK2 and wanting to trade it all in for a Canon or Nikon system to actually liking it and now wanting to refine my understanding of the camera to take great pictures. This is essentially down to the people who use this forum and have provided guidance and help, thank you. I am not connected to Olympus or any camera manufacturer or anything to do with the camera industry. I am now seriously considering buying a second EM1 MK2 body with the 300mm F4 and have one body with 40-150 and one with 300mm permanently attached.... why.... we'll, I find I am missing many great shots whilst changing lenses. Will plan to use the 1.4x convertor with the 300mm F4 lens. Thanks again for your help

Maria
1st May 2017, 04:56 PM
It's taken me some time to get used to the EM1 MkII, after moving from the GH4 (and wondering if I should have waited for the GH5) - but I'm pretty sure I made the right decision now. My hubby has a full frame Canon - but I couldn't handle the weight of that setup, which is why I went for M4/3 in the first place. The EM1 MkII and Panasonic 100-400 is about as much as I can handle - and is proving to be a terrific and flexible combination. As the pair of us go out photographing together and have the same interests, I can compare shots with my hubby - I know that his camera does better at silly ISOs and he is more experienced at panning than me but now I have a camera capable of catching birds in flight and my panning skills are starting to improve a bit (still need more practice) I realise that my rate of keepers is approaching his.

I've heard Andy Rousse speak too - quite an entertainer, as well as a great photographer. It's easy to be disheartened with your own results when you see work like his - but no wildlife photographer, however good, will get it right all of the time.

I'm pleased to have been able to get shots like these, taken last weekend at Muncaster Castle - and I know my hit rate has improved with my new setup, compared to previous visits:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4186/34193202891_409553989d_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/U6x6WT)Muncaster Herons (https://flic.kr/p/U6x6WT) by Maria (https://www.flickr.com/photos/31693460@N06/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2886/33477691783_acc7a4a55a_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/T1iVqt)Black Kite (https://flic.kr/p/T1iVqt) by Maria (https://www.flickr.com/photos/31693460@N06/), on Flickr

Goshawk
1st May 2017, 05:11 PM
It's taken me some time to get used to the EM1 MkII, after moving from the GH4 (and wondering if I should have waited for the GH5) - but I'm pretty sure I made the right decision now. My hubby has a full frame Canon - but I couldn't handle the weight of that setup, which is why I went for M4/3 in the first place. The EM1 MkII and Panasonic 100-400 is about as much as I can handle - and is proving to be a terrific and flexible combination. As the pair of us go out photographing together and have the same interests, I can compare shots with my hubby - I know that his camera does better at silly ISOs and he is more experienced at panning than me but now I have a camera capable of catching birds in flight and my panning skills are starting to improve a bit (still need more practice) I realise that my rate of keepers is approaching his.

I've heard Andy Rousse speak too - quite an entertainer, as well as a great photographer. It's easy to be disheartened with your own results when you see work like his - but no wildlife photographer, however good, will get it right all of the time.

I'm pleased to have been able to get shots like these, taken last weekend at Muncaster Castle - and I know my hit rate has improved with my new setup, compared to previous visits:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4186/34193202891_409553989d_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/U6x6WT)Muncaster Herons (https://flic.kr/p/U6x6WT) by Maria (https://www.flickr.com/photos/31693460@N06/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2886/33477691783_acc7a4a55a_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/T1iVqt)Black Kite (https://flic.kr/p/T1iVqt) by Maria (https://www.flickr.com/photos/31693460@N06/), on Flickr

Thanks for providing a couple of your examples.... now if I can get images of that quality I will be over the moon... As you mentioned, I'll have to keep practicing with settings till I find ones that suit me. Think I'm getting there slowly.

Thanks

Tony

Can I ask what settings you used, did you use the CAF+ tracking option, have you set your camera to loose or tight settings e.g 0, +1,+2 or -1,-2 was it full matrix or 5 /9 point focusing. Do you have back button focus enabled or are you using the shutter button to focus and take the photo?

Lots of questions, but it would help me to compare what I have configured if there are any similarities between our configurations BIF.

Many thanks

Tony

wornish
1st May 2017, 05:50 PM
I'm pleased to have been able to get shots like these, taken last weekend at Muncaster Castle - and I know my hit rate has improved with my new setup, compared to previous visits:



Wow - Fantastic shots.

GyRob
10th May 2017, 10:40 PM
A couple from tonight these were single point it does seem to be the most accurate but not always practical as its hard to keep on the bird so I did miss quite a few shots .
I really do think the center point should have more power to focus i.e be more sensitive over all other points so the other point's Only help if the center cant get focus I'm sure this would settle the camera down a bit .
Rob.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P5100180--SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93086)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P5100208-SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93087)

Goshawk
11th May 2017, 04:33 AM
A couple from tonight these were single point it does seem to be the most accurate but not always practical as its hard to keep on the bird so I did miss quite a few shots .
I really do think the center point should have more power to focus i.e be more sensitive over all other points so the other point's Only help if the center cant get focus I'm sure this would settle the camera down a bit .
Rob.

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P5100180--SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93086)

http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P5100208-SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93087)

Couple of great shots. But as you say trying to capture action like this I found very hit and miss, very very few keepers and some times none at all could be kept due to them not being sufficiently in focus or very noisy or both. The problem got worse in low light conditions and when I had to try and use above ISO 800 in low light, grey skies to try and capture birds of prey in flight it was almost impossible get get any keepers. Unless the bird almost totally filled the frame, it was hopeless, out of focus very noisy, extremly frustrating...

I gave it a go for a few months, but my time, cost of petrol to get to locations and the frustration of getting extremely few keepers has driven me to sell everything and replace with the Nikon D500 and the Nikon 200-500 lens. Yes it weighs considerably more, can't hold it up as long as I could with the EM1 MK2 and the Pana 100-400 lens, it dosen't have the same 800mm reach... but the results I am getting from this combination far outweigh the negatives... it's focus system is spot on, it's focus tracking is spot on, the picture quality is sublime, the ISO noise or lack of it is amazing, I can confident deftly crop the image And know I will still have a great quality picture... I have taken pics of a swallow @ 81,000+ ISO which is better than I was getting from the em1 MK2 using 1600 ISO.

Don't get me wrong the em1 MK2 and lens combinations I had were great and they have a place. I took some really great consistent quality photos with the system, but that consistency did not work for BIF which is what I needed it for 95% of the time. If you're looking for consistency of quality, being able to get very good, not acceptable but very good quality images consistently of BIF in our UK variable light conditions of all size BIF. I found on a personal basis the Oly system just didn't work for me. It was just too frustrating to use.

The Nikon system is spot on everytime every shot... probably not what the Oly owners want to hear, but these have been my frustrating experiences of a few months of Oly ownership.

GyRob
11th May 2017, 07:31 AM
I do agree with a lot of your points but I am finding it nearly always give some good shot's
I have never tried the Pana 100-400 lens that may well not have helped with your keeper rate compared with the 300 pro I think the pro gets the best out of the camera a bit like the L series canon sure other lenses are good but just a tad behind All the time.
Rob.

Phill D
11th May 2017, 07:59 AM
Well you certainly gave it a fair go Goshawk, hope the Nikon system works out for you. Hope you got good prices for your gear.

Olybirder
11th May 2017, 08:45 AM
I think this article is quite interesting and relevant:

http://mirrorlesscomparison.com/best/mirrorless-cameras-for-wildlife-and-bird-photography/

It assesses the suitability of the current range of mirrorless cameras and lenses for wildlife and bird photography and compares them to the best DSLRs. In brief, it concludes that the Nikon D500 gives the most reliable results but that mirrorless cameras, such as the E-M1 Mk2 are not too far behind.

I priced up the Nikon D500D and 200-500mm f/5.6 yesterday and it was actually cheaper than the E-M1 Mk2 with the Pan/Leica 100-400. However, I also compared the weights and, unfortunately, there is no way I could carry the Nikon combo. If the weight is not an issue then buying the Nikon is a 'no brainer' decision, if you shoot BIF. If the weight is a problem then the latest mirrorless cameras seem to be a good compromise.

Ron

Goshawk
11th May 2017, 09:24 AM
Well you certainly gave it a fair go Goshawk, hope the Nikon system works out for you. Hope you got good prices for your gear.

Hi Phil, regrettably I didn't be as good a price as I had wished for, that said I now have a system that delivers the goods.

DavyG
11th May 2017, 10:53 AM
Hi Phil, regrettably I didn't be as good a price as I had wished for, that said I now have a system that delivers the goods.

Sorry to hear that you've sold your Olympus kit and moved over to Nikon Goshawk however, it's right to choose the equipment that does the job for you.

I recently bought my wife an E-M1 II and a 300mm Pro, she already had the Panasonic 100-400 but preferred the images my 300mm was producing.

We took a trip to Bempton Cliffs in order to give her a good opportunity to practice with the new kit and get the hang of using it, bearing in mind that she has little or no prior experience of photographing BiF, here are some of her images.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4175/34560981325_4e3c6cdc75_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/UE34En)Kittiwake (https://flic.kr/p/UE34En) by Anita Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/147845000@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4177/33725428983_6084830927_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TocD4v)Gannet (https://flic.kr/p/TocD4v) by Anita Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/147845000@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4177/34471368096_8b3d4a3263_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Uw7LLG)Razorbill (https://flic.kr/p/Uw7LLG) by Anita Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/147845000@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4174/34127184030_2dedeb88c3_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/TZGJQE)Puffin (https://flic.kr/p/TZGJQE) by Anita Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/147845000@N05/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4175/34519862866_6da11d7316_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/UApjzq)Puffin (https://flic.kr/p/UApjzq) by Anita Goodwin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/147845000@N05/), on Flickr

I appreciate that these were taken in good light conditions however, I think they demonstrate that the Olympus kit can capture images of BiF.

Dave

BreezeG
11th May 2017, 02:02 PM
I have the D500 and Nikkor 80-400 as well as the EM1ii and 40-150pro, 1.4tc.
I get some great results with the Oly kit for most subjects but I bought the Panasonic 100-400 to bring to Spain for birding rather than the heavier Nikon kit. After two weeks shooting, even in excellent light I can confidently say that for birds in flight the Nikon combination wins hands down. The focus on the Nikon works every time whereas it is really hit and miss with the Oly. I havent tried the Oly 300mm lens but I see no point in throwing more money away. The Panasonic lens will be up for sale when I get back to the UK.

DavyG
11th May 2017, 03:08 PM
I have the D500 and Nikkor 80-400 as well as the EM1ii and 40-150pro, 1.4tc.
I get some great results with the Oly kit for most subjects but I bought the Panasonic 100-400 to bring to Spain for birding rather than the heavier Nikon kit. After two weeks shooting, even in excellent light I can confidently say that for birds in flight the Nikon combination wins hands down. The focus on the Nikon works every time whereas it is really hit and miss with the Oly. I havent tried the Oly 300mm lens but I see no point in throwing more money away. The Panasonic lens will be up for sale when I get back to the UK.

I haven't used the Nikon kit as I'm happy with the results I achieve with my Olympus kit.

Having bought two 300mm Pro lenses, I wouldn't class myself as having thrown money away, I'm very content.

We also have the Panasonic 100-400mm lens which, at 400mm is relatively slow as f6.3 however, the Oly 300mm at 300mm is f4.0 and even with the MC-14 is f5.6 at 420mm.

Why don't you try borrowing a 300mm Pro through the Olympus Test and Wow programme? You may be pleasantly surprised.

I'm not suggesting that the Olympus E-M1 II and the 300mm Pro are necessarily better or as good as the Nikon D500 for BiF, I haven't tested the Nikon kit and, as BiF are a small part of my photography, I don't think I need a second system.

Dave

BreezeG
11th May 2017, 05:18 PM
I was speaking for myself. The 300mm Oly is an excellent lens and produces wonderful images. I feel though, that I personally would be throwing my money away because even with that lens the EM1ii cant compete with the D500 in autofocus (especially tracking).
Having both systems I am not interested in supporting one over the other....the Oly has some excellent features and I love the silent shutter compared to the clatter of the Nikon. I will use the Nikon for bird photography and the Oly for everything else.

GyRob
14th May 2017, 09:35 PM
One from tonight ,I went back to 5 af points although Owls move slow they do go up and down a lot.
Rob
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P5140147-small.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93128)

DanC.Licks
1st June 2017, 06:17 PM
Hi Guys,
Haven't been around here in a while. With so many forums I sort of lose track, and I had forgotten just how good this one is*chr
Anyway, I have given a lot of thought to how to set up my Mark II for birds, and rather than write it all again, here is a link:
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=343596
Still working on it, but it is getting where I want it, slowly.
There has been some discussion about the single AF box being too big. (* I refer to using FT lenses or adapted lenses like my standard Canon 400/5.6/Metabones setup which only use the camera's PDAF system). I found it a bit harder to really be selective with the single point compared to the Mark I, so getting small birds in the branches was more difficult with the Mark II, until...
It might be my imagination (I don't honestly think so) but it seems to me that the firmware update to 1.2 has not only made the EVF somewhat nicer, (*) it has made the single AF point more selective and precise, as well as made the general AF quicker and smoother. Has anyone else observed this?

Dan

Be gone for a few days and hope to give it more of a workout and will report back.

blu-by-u
2nd June 2017, 01:50 AM
.....
It might be my imagination (I don't honestly think so) but it seems to me that the firmware update to 1.2 has not only made the EVF somewhat nicer, it has made the single AF point more selective and precise, as well as made the general AF quicker and smoother. .....

Have been holding out on this update..You have made me decide to get it. :D Thanks

Olybirder
2nd June 2017, 07:55 AM
Yestrday I was attempting to photograph a Stonechat (a Sparrow sized bird) which was perched on a post with bushes and trees in the background some way behind it. I was using the single point AF but each time I placed the green rectangle over the bird and half pressed the shutter the camera focused on the background and the subject was completely blurred. If I pointed the camera down and focused on the base of the post it snapped into focus. However if I then placed the rectangle over the bird and pressed the button again it would either focus on the bird or the background, apparently at random. I was surprised and rather disappointed by this as I thought the cross-type AF points should have cured this problem.

Ron

Phill D
2nd June 2017, 08:03 AM
Ron there were a few comments made at Duxford last Friday that suggested Olympus were listening to the small af area comments and working on firmware updates. Don't know when but it was hinted. Hope it's not just wishful thinking and I've not misinterpreted what was said. I'd like to think they would also restore my much lamented sunset mode too but I forgot to ask about that.

drmarkf
2nd June 2017, 08:25 AM
Ron there were a few comments made at Duxford last Friday that suggested Olympus were listening to the small af area comments and working on firmware updates. Don't know when but it was hinted. Hope it's not just wishful thinking and I've not misinterpreted what was said.

No, you're right. Clearly they weren't allowed to say it directly without having to kill us, but if there isn't a smaller option by the autumn I'll eat my 300.

Claire also said only about half of the firmware memory is used currently, so a series of additional capabilities are on the way via future updates. That is going to complicate the menus further, of course, and my brain will probably explode.

GyRob
2nd June 2017, 08:28 AM
The green rectangle focus point is 3 times bigger than shown so does tend to grab something away from the centre of it .

Rob.

c12402
2nd June 2017, 08:53 AM
Just a suggestion for difficult scenes as described, do you have already separated the focus function to another button different from the shutter release? I improved a lot since I got used to it with my new em1.2.

c12402
2nd June 2017, 10:14 AM
After a horrible first day, I found that setting lens reset parameter to OFF gave me a much better hit rate.

The issue is that the camera performs a lens reset every time it goes to idle state, not every time you switched off. In real life, that means a lot of focus hunting every time between shots.

All other recommendations already made in previous posts are also mandatory for BIF, in particular use L mode (max 10 frames per second) and silent mode. i have not found any trace of rolling shutter, even in difficult cases (eg. Wind mill blades rotating at quite high speed).

blu-by-u
3rd June 2017, 03:10 AM
.....but if there isn't a smaller option by the autumn I'll eat my 300.......my brain will probably explode.
:eek: Please don't eat that 300.. ;) I would gladly relief you from indigestion ..just send it my way.*yes

GyRob
4th June 2017, 07:47 AM
I was out birding and this deer did not see me, yet again the Silent shutter did its magic I even had to make a tut tut sound to make it turn and look my way it was 50 ft away.
Rob.
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/P6030145-CROP-SMALL.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/93423)

GyRob
4th June 2017, 01:00 PM
I think so ,the horns look like they can cause some damage that's for sure.
Rob.

Olybirder
11th August 2017, 10:25 PM
After a few months of using my E-M1 II I have come to the conclusion that the AF is nowhere near as accurate as my Mk I. I have tried changing the settings as other users have recommended but I am still not getting sharp images.

Today I took over 140 shots of a Kingfisher in good light over a 15 minute period. I was really excited and couldn't wait to have a look at the results. After a quick scan through them in FastRawViewer I couldn't find a single sharp image. Of course it could be that FastRawViewer is not giving an accurate representation of the file and that they might look better when they are developed properly. However, at the moment I feel like chucking the bloody thing in the skip.

Ron

Ross the fiddler
12th August 2017, 01:11 AM
After a few months of using my E-M1 II I have come to the conclusion that the AF is nowhere near as accurate as my Mk I. I have tried changing the settings as other users have recommended but I am still not getting sharp images.

Today I took over 140 shots of a Kingfisher in good light over a 15 minute period. I was really excited and couldn't wait to have a look at the results. After a quick scan through them in FastRawViewer I couldn't find a single sharp image. Of course it could be that FastRawViewer is not giving an accurate representation of the file and that they might look better when they are developed properly. However, at the moment I feel like chucking the bloody thing in the skip.

Ron

Can you show us a couple of the photos & with crops of the focus target area please. Also can you add settings for those images & lens used.

blu-by-u
12th August 2017, 02:15 AM
.... I am still not getting sharp images.
.... However, at the moment I feel like chucking the bloody thing in the skip.

Ron

Please don't chuck..Pass it gently to me.:D

I am still not getting 100% accurate but sometimes, it out performs that mk1. Seriously I too am am not sure what's with this Mk2. At times it's perfect and then it can be a pain.

Ross the fiddler
12th August 2017, 04:45 AM
At least the 14-54 II lens focusses nicely (& accurately) on the Mk II instead of just racking back & forth on the E-M1 (Mk I) when it struggles.

wornish
12th August 2017, 06:59 AM
After a few months of using my E-M1 II I have come to the conclusion that the AF is nowhere near as accurate as my Mk I. I have tried changing the settings as other users have recommended but I am still not getting sharp images.

Today I took over 140 shots of a Kingfisher in good light over a 15 minute period. I was really excited and couldn't wait to have a look at the results. After a quick scan through them in FastRawViewer I couldn't find a single sharp image. Of course it could be that FastRawViewer is not giving an accurate representation of the file and that they might look better when they are developed properly. However, at the moment I feel like chucking the bloody thing in the skip.

Ron

What lens was being used? Plus as others have already asked can you share an image and exif data.

mack100
12th August 2017, 07:07 AM
Were these images of the kingfisher perched or in flight?

Tordan58
12th August 2017, 10:25 AM
Hi Ron,

I'm sad to read that. May I ask what lens you are using? 50-200SWD + EC14?

Could you post some photos for us to have a look what could be wrong? If possible with some foreground/background in addition to subject.

What I found when giving 50-200SWD + EC14 a try with the E-M1 M2 the other day is that my copy seemed to require AF calibration. Ater coming home from the session I ran a test using focus chart that revealed it was front focusing quite a bit which required -3 or -4 on the telephoto end.

/Tord

Ross the fiddler
13th August 2017, 12:59 PM
After a few months of using my E-M1 II I have come to the conclusion that the AF is nowhere near as accurate as my Mk I. I have tried changing the settings as other users have recommended but I am still not getting sharp images.

Today I took over 140 shots of a Kingfisher in good light over a 15 minute period. I was really excited and couldn't wait to have a look at the results. After a quick scan through them in FastRawViewer I couldn't find a single sharp image. Of course it could be that FastRawViewer is not giving an accurate representation of the file and that they might look better when they are developed properly. However, at the moment I feel like chucking the bloody thing in the skip.

Ron

Ron, maybe this is worth reading (or not).
SCOTT BOURNEíS BIRD PHOTOGRAPHY GEAR GUIDE
Micro Four Thirds Olympus Edition (https://spark.adobe.com/page/WuwmbVyXe6NLl/)
Is he being paid for this? :rolleyes:

Olybirder
14th August 2017, 05:38 PM
Well I have calmed down a bit now and I have had another look at my Kingfisher shots. They are not quite as bad as I first thought.

The first thing is that FastRawViewer doesn't seem to give a very good idea of what the images actually look like. When I open them in Apple Photos or Affinity Photo they look a bit better. The second thing is that I was obviously further away from the bird than I remember and 283mm focal length is probably not quite enough.

I started off shooting with my S-AF settings but when the Kingfisher dived down to catch a fish, I switched over to my C-AF settings to get a faster shutter speed. This increased the ISO to about 800, creating more noise. I also neglected to change the AF points from five to single and I think that could account for the poor focusing.

Here are five sample shots. The first (uncropped) one gives a general impression of the size of the bird in the viewfinder. The next three are crops of S-AF files and the final one is a crop of a typical C-AF image. Hopefully, the exif data is intact.


http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1175/Kingfisher_test_3.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/94905)


http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1175/Kingfisher_test_3small.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/94906)


http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1175/Kingfisher_test_1_small.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/94904)


http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1175/Kingfisher_test_4_small.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/94907)


http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/1175/Kingfisher_fail.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/94903)


Ron

Bengeo
14th August 2017, 06:36 PM
I think you will have to do a focus test with your 50-200 and EC-14 and probably calibrate your AF. If you don't have any specific test gear, then just set the camera up on a tripod and and put 3 bottles with detailed labels staggered an inch or two apart. Focus on the middle bottle and check if you have front or back focus. Try and get a good distance to the bottles if possible.

bassman
14th August 2017, 09:08 PM
Hi Ron,


I'd agree with doing a focus test, don't think you'll be too far off but could be a touch of front focus, as Tord experienced. Looking at the 2nd, 3rd and 4th shots, not sure if shutter speed caused any softness, would have been great to see those at 1/1250 or 1/1600th.


Mark

wornish
14th August 2017, 09:28 PM
As already said single point focus would certainly help. You were at 1/500 sec on a stationary object, but the branch its standing on appears to be soft as well. I assume you had is-auto enabled.

I think its just a case of being too far away. You only have a very small area to get any detail from and you are really cropping significantly to get a larger view of the bird.

Tordan58
14th August 2017, 10:45 PM
Ron,

These are indeed out of focus. It looks like front focus as the tail seems sharper than the beak (photos 1 and 2), however as you write the bird occupies too little of the frame to draw conclusion.

The shutter speed 1/400 is fast enough for this lens, unless it was really windy.

Olybirder
14th August 2017, 11:03 PM
Thanks for the replies. I will have to research what is involved in performing AF focus adjustment. Do you have to do separate adjustments for different focal lengths with a zoom lens and with or without the teleconverter?

Ron

Ross the fiddler
15th August 2017, 01:11 AM
Thanks for the replies. I will have to research what is involved in performing AF focus adjustment. Do you have to do separate adjustments for different focal lengths with a zoom lens and with or without the teleconverter?

Ron

There are two basic settings available, wide & tele & I had my same lens combination set at -1 tele while the 50-200 SWD lens alone needed -3 at the tele end (wide seemed OK). I would suggest only doing the overall setting as different settings can be made for each focus point; something one really has to be pedantic to do, but do please make that single adjustment & you will be much happier with the results. Also do keep in mind the actual PD-AF area seems to be larger than the green box. Using Magnified function at X 14 (not magnifying it though) should give a smaller area if needed & that can be by touch focus or the Multifunction Fn2 button.

*chr

GyRob
15th August 2017, 07:36 AM
I would try the same settings on a cereal box in good light that covers 1/4 - 1/3 of the frame Ron
The King Fisher is just too far away and at 800iso as you crop it will lose lots of detail .
I Think you are just beyond the limits of the setup giving anything but a nice record shot .
Rob.

Phill D
15th August 2017, 07:47 AM
Interesting comment GyRob
"I Think you are just beyond the limits of the setup giving anything but a nice record shot"
I've heard similar comments before too from others here. It's obviously lens related but what would you suggest were the distance limits for shooting birds.

GyRob
15th August 2017, 08:22 AM
It gets a little complicated Phil for a record shot there is no limit but for a nice detailed
shot the closer the better I have Olympus kit but am a canon shooter too 1dxmkII and 600f4isL mkII
My 100/400 zoom will give just as good a shot if I'm closer as my 600 f4 costing 5 times( edit 9 times ) as much at twice the distance .
If the bird was closer then the 600 wins .
But iso comes into it too
My 600 is a stop faster so I can use a lower ISO so this brings some detail back when cropping OR I can have a faster shutter speed OR stop down a stop it does depend on the bird, for flight I will always go for faster shutter i.e its better to have a sharp slightly noisy shot than a soft no noise shot .
Rob.

wornish
15th August 2017, 08:40 AM
Interesting comment GyRob
"I Think you are just beyond the limits of the setup giving anything but a nice record shot"
I've heard similar comments before too from others here. It's obviously lens related but what would you suggest were the distance limits for shooting birds.

I think it depends on the size of the bird - Ostrich (OK, Eagle) vs Hummingbird and how much of the frame they fill when taking the shot.

If its very small then when you crop and enlarge the picture you start to see the limit of the particular lens resolution capability and also diffusion effects. Then add in the post processing effects caused by pixel copying to make the image larger and you end up with a more blurry image. You can also get blurry images when the bird is very close caused by having a very shallow depth of field.

wornish
15th August 2017, 08:42 AM
I would try the same settings on a cereal box in good light that covers 1/4 - 1/3 of the frame Ron
The King Fisher is just too far away and at 800iso as you crop it will lose lots of detail .
I Think you are just beyond the limits of the setup giving anything but a nice record shot .
Rob.

Not heard the term record shot. Can you explain what it means?

TonyR
15th August 2017, 08:55 AM
Not heard the term record shot. Can you explain what it means?

For your own records. Just to show you saw it.

GyRob
15th August 2017, 08:56 AM
its a birding term It refers to a non detailed shot or a shot for your records
Rob.

GyRob
15th August 2017, 10:21 AM
Can I just add I check all my lenses and cameras on a static subject (cereal box ) if a long lens 300 400 600 about 60ft away and then with a tc attached .bright calm day 1/2000sec 400iso and wide open I may also use the self timer ,single point with S-AF .


I also take a reference shot manual focus in live view then I have something to compare with .


I may have to then play with MA and do it all again but This tells me under optimum conditions my gear is OK you really need to know this before you go out .


the above should then give you 90 percent sharp shots and the other 10 close or you did something wrong .


C-AF is always going to be a lower hit rate because you no longer have full control the lens is constantly looking for focus and if hand holding you will be rocking back and forth so the lens will be seeing this .


It will also see heat haze the further away your subject the more it will see



Just my thoughts .


Can I just add I check all my lenses and cameras on a static subject (cereal box ) if a long lens 300 400 600 about 60ft away and then with a tc attached .bright calm day 1/2000sec 400iso and wide open I may also use the self timer ,single point with S-AF .


I also take a reference shot manual focus in live view then I have something to compare with .


I may have to then play with MA and do it all again but This tells me under optimum conditions my gear is OK you really need to know this before you go out .


the above should then give you 90 percent sharp shots and the other 10 close or you did something wrong .


C-AF is always going to be a lower hit rate because you no longer have full control the lens is constantly looking for focus and if hand holding you will be rocking back and forth so the lens will be seeing this .


It will also see heat haze the further away your subject the more it will see



Just my thoughts .


Rob.

GyRob
15th August 2017, 10:30 AM
I'm quite happy if I get a BIF like this, I took this just after doing my tests
it was about 70 ft away


E-M1mark II 300f4 1/3200 f4 iso 400


Rob.

Phill D
15th August 2017, 08:43 PM
Thanks for the explanations guys much appreciated.

Alec
30th August 2017, 11:56 AM
I have also had focusing issues with this camera, both on 300 F4 and 40-150 f2.8. Principally losing eye focus on animals. Tried switching to s- af and eventually., when possible, switching to manual and getting better shots. Had a pro in the jeep, he couldn't figure it out either. I think it's a great camera but it's not straightforward when it comes to diagnostics, at least for me.

TonyR
30th August 2017, 02:46 PM
I have also had focusing issues with this camera, both on 300 F4 and 40-150 f2.8. Principally losing eye focus on animals. Tried switching to s- af and eventually., when possible, switching to manual and getting better shots. Had a pro in the jeep, he couldn't figure it out either. I think it's a great camera but it's not straightforward when it comes to diagnostics, at least for me.

I think face recognition and eye focus only works on people. When it is working you should see a white square around the face and a green square around the detected eye. If you don't see that, it has not detected an eye.

drmarkf
30th August 2017, 03:14 PM
I think face recognition and eye focus only works on people. When it is working you should see a white square around the face and a green square around the detected eye. If you don't see that, it has not detected an eye.

I don't think that's what Alec's saying, Tony (although I'm sure he'll speak for himself...): isn't this perhaps more likely due to the large focus point issue interacting with small birds, or to using 5 or 9 points and the camera locking on to some other part of the body than the head because it happened to have higher contrast?

I believe I have encountered both of these, and when possible I choose & move 1 point, or else quickly grab manual focus.

TonyR
30th August 2017, 05:43 PM
I don't think that's what Alec's saying, Tony (although I'm sure he'll speak for himself...): isn't this perhaps more likely due to the large focus point issue interacting with small birds, or to using 5 or 9 points and the camera locking on to some other part of the body than the head because it happened to have higher contrast?

I believe I have encountered both of these, and when possible I choose & move 1 point, or else quickly grab manual focus.

Ah, could be. My bad. :o

Alec
30th August 2017, 08:44 PM
Mark, you understood me correctly but I was not very clear. I don't use eye recognition for nature shots but almost always look for the "look" to get some expressiveness, especially with mammals but birds too. I think you are correct about one point, that has often been my choice, along with manual focus but I still don't really understand why some shots appear to be doused on the body withe thresultant loss of sharpness in the eye. Your theory about using a greater contrast and the focal point kind of makes sense but I wouldn't know how to overcome that except going manual all the way which I'm not good enough to do on safari. Probably need to investigate a custom setting.
Alec

TonyR
31st August 2017, 09:01 AM
Mark, you understood me correctly but I was not very clear. I don't use eye recognition for nature shots but almost always look for the "look" to get some expressiveness, especially with mammals but birds too. I think you are correct about one point, that has often been my choice, along with manual focus but I still don't really understand why some shots appear to be doused on the body withe thresultant loss of sharpness in the eye. Your theory about using a greater contrast and the focal point kind of makes sense but I wouldn't know how to overcome that except going manual all the way which I'm not good enough to do on safari. Probably need to investigate a custom setting.
Alec

I use Zoom AF in these situations but it is only any good if your subjects sits still for long enough.

Olybirder
31st August 2017, 09:46 AM
My hands are not steady enough to use Magnify Assist at 300 mm, as the magnified image jiggles about wildly in the viewfinder rendering it unusable. It is probably better with a tripod or if there is a support for my elbows but most of the time I use Peaking instead.

Ron

Goon525
4th September 2017, 04:45 PM
Like others here, I'm suffering from focusing issues, even on stationary birds, where even with the smallest focus box, I find it tends to focus on a branch, not the bird that is pretty much filling the box. This with the Panny 100-400.

Does anyone have any inkling as to when the much vaunted major firmware update, hopefully introducing a smaller box and improving AF in other respects, might be coming?

TonyR
4th September 2017, 05:46 PM
Like others here, I'm suffering from focusing issues, even on stationary birds, where even with the smallest focus box, I find it tends to focus on a branch, not the bird that is pretty much filling the box. This with the Panny 100-400.

Does anyone have any inkling as to when the much vaunted major firmware update, hopefully introducing a smaller box and improving AF in other respects, might be coming?

My wild-assed guess would be that, since it hasn't arrived yet, the firmware update will be around the anniversary of the launch. So November.

Ross the fiddler
4th September 2017, 09:23 PM
My wild-assed guess would be that, since it hasn't arrived yet, the firmware update will be around the anniversary of the launch. So November.

My wild guess it would be something they would do then with possible added features as a 'kick a long' for the model about that time too, so hopefully something better can happen in the AF area. Their AF algorithms leave me a little puzzled sometimes on how to deal with some situations. I still wonder how it interprets the 'magnified' (small box) method such as using the 14 X small size as I would think it should revert to CD-AF, but it then depends on how that is handled in the camera compared to previous CD-AF models.

TonyR
4th September 2017, 10:39 PM
My wild guess it would be something they would do then with possible added features as a 'kick a long' for the model about that time too, so hopefully something better can happen in the AF area. Their AF algorithms leave me a little puzzled sometimes on how to deal with some situations. I still wonder how it interprets the 'magnified' (small box) method such as using the 14 X small size as I would think it should revert to CD-AF, but it then depends on how that is handled in the camera compared to previous CD-AF models.

I think you are right about the Zoom-AF using CD-AF. It will focus accurately on fine detail like feather texture when zoomed in a sufficient amount which is why I usually use it for static birds.

I have been a bit disappointed by the pdaf on the MkII in respect of its inability to identify and focus on the nearest subject in the image. It seems to only be able to do this if the near subject occupies quite a large part of the selected focus area. It seems that DSLRs are still much better in this respect. Whilst I hope that this improves with a firmware update, it may just be a consequence of the sensitivity of on-sensor pdaf. Separate AF modules can use whopping great pixels that gather a lot of light whilst the on-sensor version is limited to the size of a pixel (or perhaps several pixels). So, if it is a hardware issue, it is unlikely to get much better in a firmware update. This may be related to why Olympus removed the smallest AF point.

I have also been disappointed by the apparent complete absence of any predictive AF. A cursory look at the exif files of a sequence of images seems to suggest that, when the subject is lost (AF not used), the focus just stays locked where it was. I would have expected the AF to work out, over a sequnce of pdaf cycles, the way the distance to the subject is changing and extrapolate in a half-sensible way when the subject is lost for a moment. I would also expect it to use this extrapolated distance value to help it re-acquire the correct subject when it comes back into view. I mean, how hard can it be? As an ex-software person with a background in geometry and graphics, I'd love to spend time with their firmware engineers.

bassman
4th September 2017, 10:48 PM
Don't know if anybody else has seen this page, from Asia Olympus ? I've not seen this myself, on our UK site and there's certainly more practical detail, regards the AF system.

http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em1mk2/feature.html


Mark

Ross the fiddler
5th September 2017, 12:26 AM
Don't know if anybody else has seen this page, from Asia Olympus ? I've not seen this myself, on our UK site and there's certainly more practical detail, regards the AF system.

http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em1mk2/feature.html


Mark

That's also on the Australian site too. *yes
https://www.olympus.com.au/Products/Interchangeable-Lens-Cameras/Olympus-OM-D/E-M1-Mark-II/Features/High-speed-Performance

MJ224
5th September 2017, 08:49 AM
Don't really understand what its all about..............

When using my Pany 100-400, I rarely get a focus problem. If I do, I just go to manual focus, with peaking. Only for fairly static subjects obviously.

I have had bad focus with other Oly lenses, unsure why though. With the Pro lenses, all seems pretty good to me, certainly as good as my ability anyway :)

But I don't use the camera to its extremes, I am not that good:(

*chr

DavyG
5th September 2017, 09:51 AM
Don't really understand what its all about..............

When using my Pany 100-400, I rarely get a focus problem. If I do, I just go to manual focus, with peaking. Only for fairly static subjects obviously.

I have had bad focus with other Oly lenses, unsure why though. With the Pro lenses, all seems pretty good to me, certainly as good as my ability anyway :)

But I don't use the camera to its extremes, I am not that good:(

*chr

I've found the same as Mark.

I've photographed a number of different subjects this year and rarely have any difficulty with focussing.

When I used my E-M1, I used C-AF + Tr for wildlife, most of the time however, this doesn't seem to work the same on the EM1 II therefore, I tend to use it for BiF or moving subjects only.

In addition, I've noticed that, when using C-AF on the E-M1 II, the camera will move in and out of focus if the subject has little contrast, especially if I keep the shutter button half pressed for any length of time before taking the image.

There are a number of examples of images taken recently on my Flickr page, if anyone is interested. I think these show the focussing works well, any flaws in the images are down to me rather than the equipment.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/144249381@N05/

Dave

damianmkv
13th September 2017, 01:23 PM
i had my first go of the mk2 at the weekend with the test&wow and found it a noticeable improvement over the mk1, specifically in terms of battery life and high ISO.

I don't see any IQ difference at all

For AF, i found it pretty consistent in C-AF. In C-AF + TR, i found that the camera would focus correctly for 5 out of 6 consecutive shots, then jump to the fence ( i was at Santa Pod ) then back to the car, all whilst the focus box was on the car. Odd.

For me, its not worth the money to go to the mk2

mik
10th May 2018, 06:51 AM
Tracking is a waste of space - turn it off. Face recognition is very good, but only for faces ;)


I discussed CAF setup with Tesni Ward, who spoke at The Photography Show about using the mkii on wildlife (with excellent results), and her recommendations are:

- CAF Scanner - mode 2
- Tracking off
- Single focus point, with 5 or 9 point sometimes if the subject suits it
- AF Lock - tight (-5)

Technique then requires keeping the subject under the focus point (s). If Olympus ever fix tracking, it'll make this aspect a lot simpler!

Sorry to drag an old thread up but a lot of info in it.

I am struggling with C-AF not saying it isn't me but i could do it on Panasonic, so i am thinking part new camera and part settings.
I can catch BIF with S-AF but of course not getting such a steam of shots to choose from.
Again possibly me and the menu system/wording but what is this AF Lock you have set at -5.

Thanks

Growltiger
10th May 2018, 01:55 PM
He means AF Sensitivity, and I think he means -2. (The name changed with later firmware)


I personally think +2 (High) is better, if you can keep the subject in the focus point. If you can't then yes, 0 or -1 or even -2 (Low) may be better.


The lower settings means it waits a bit before refocussing.

mik
10th May 2018, 02:01 PM
He means AF Sensitivity, and I think he means -2. (The name changed with later firmware)


I personally think +2 (High) is better, if you can keep the subject in the focus point. If you can't then yes, 0 or -1 or even -2 (Low) may be better.


The lower settings means it waits a bit before refocussing.


Thanks i did wonder if that was it, thinking now it may not be the C-AF as such ime struggling with,i have always used IS to give me a steadier image to keep the single focus point where i want it,noticed today my 100-400 has an intermittent problem where after settling it jitters again.
It happened on still subjects which allowed me to notice it.

drmarkf
10th May 2018, 03:18 PM
Sorry to drag an old thread up but a lot of info in it.

I am struggling with C-AF not saying it isn't me but i could do it on Panasonic, so i am thinking part new camera and part settings.
I can catch BIF with S-AF but of course not getting such a steam of shots to choose from.
Again possibly me and the menu system/wording but what is this AF Lock you have set at -5.

Thanks

Useful page: http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em1mk2/feature.html

mik
19th May 2018, 06:21 PM
Well ime still getting failures i dont understand, i have the shutter set for focus priority but still get a lot of images like this, which i cant see is miss focus.







http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2125/P5190132.jpg

mik
19th May 2018, 06:24 PM
Sorry about using two posts but i couldnt get these into the other post, these are also from today, when it works its great.


https://farm1.staticflickr.com/982/40402455930_98a5224f7e_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/24ye9xL)P5190059 (https://flic.kr/p/24ye9xL) by electric.mike (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/), on Flickr


https://farm1.staticflickr.com/952/40402455910_c16240863a_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/24ye9xq)P5190142 (https://flic.kr/p/24ye9xq) by electric.mike (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/), on Flickr


https://farm1.staticflickr.com/954/40400775030_019512e1aa_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/24y5wSJ)P5190144 (https://flic.kr/p/24y5wSJ) by electric.mike (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/), on Flickr


Not sure where to look for the solution

Gwyver
20th May 2018, 06:45 AM
Well ime still getting failures i dont understand, i have the shutter set for focus priority but still get a lot of images like this, which i cant see is miss focus.

http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2125/P5190132.jpg

Not sure if these account for the 'mis-focus' (which may not be a C-AF related problem) but -
Unlike the further 3 examples in your subsequent post (were the bird is crossing your field of view), this bird is flying towards you - so the focus distance is changing swiftly.
Your shutter speed was only 1/400 - which is probably too slow to freeze this motion.
Also, you are using an aperture of F8, so there will be some further delay between focus 'lock' and the iris closing for the shutter to operate - which would also contribute to the 'mis-focus'.

I notice that in your subsequent post the shutter speeds are much higher (1/1250 & 1/1600) and the aperture was F5.6.
Hope this helps.

mik
20th May 2018, 07:09 AM
Not sure if these account for the 'mis-focus' (which may not be a C-AF related problem) but -
Unlike the further 3 examples in your subsequent post (were the bird is crossing your field of view), this bird is flying towards you - so the focus distance is changing swiftly.
Your shutter speed was only 1/400 - which is probably too slow to freeze this motion.
Also, you are using an aperture of F8, so there will be some further delay between focus 'lock' and the iris closing for the shutter to operate - which would also contribute to the 'mis-focus'.

I notice that in your subsequent post the shutter speeds are much higher (1/1250 & 1/1600) and the aperture was F5.6.
Hope this helps.


Thanks, the 400th was because i swung on to it from something else and that would account for the f8 as ime on auto iso and it dropped to 200 for it.
What i cant understand is why isnt there a point of focus on the water at some point and why did it allow me to release the shutter with nothing in focus, that is a pooor example though i should have spent more time digging in the trash can for an example, if i get any today that show me doing everything right but still fail i will post one.



You have made me wonder though as ime using S the lens could be stopping down sometimes, i will try M.

Gwyver
20th May 2018, 09:23 AM
What i cant understand is why isnt there a point of focus on the water at some point and why did it allow me to release the shutter with nothing in focus,...

You have made me wonder though as ime using S the lens could be stopping down sometimes, i will try M.

Mike,
I think at the FL you used (224mm) the field of view is such that where the plane of focus intersects the waterline would fall below the bottom edge of the image frame - hence no water in focus.
The camera would have acquired focus - but at 1/400, assuming the pigeon may have been travelling at ~30mph (= 44ft/sec) whilst the shutter was open the pigeon would have moved > 1 inch towards you, thus resulting in motion blur.

My preference is to use M mode & Auto-ISO for action shots. In this mode you can also use the Function Lever to enable Exp-Comp adjustment if you know in advance that the main subject will be particularly light or dark.

mik
20th May 2018, 10:36 AM
http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2125/P5200051.jpgMike,
I think at the FL you used (224mm) the field of view is such that where the plane of focus intersects the waterline would fall below the bottom edge of the image frame - hence no water in focus.
The camera would have acquired focus - but at 1/400, assuming the pigeon may have been travelling at ~30mph (= 44ft/sec) whilst the shutter was open the pigeon would have moved > 1 inch towards you, thus resulting in motion blur.

My preference is to use M mode & Auto-ISO for action shots. In this mode you can also use the Function Lever to enable Exp-Comp adjustment if you know in advance that the main subject will be particularly light or dark.


Thanks again i hadnt thought about where the focus plane would be, good catch.
Today i went back to single point which gave me great results with the Panasonic, i have been trying 5 and 9 with the Olympus.
Dont know if thats where my problem has been but ime a lot happier with the results, ok it takes a bit more getting but the shot below is a small target and the bird was off the focus point by the time the picture was taken.



http://www.e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/2125/P5200051f.jpg

mik
20th May 2018, 10:37 AM
The pictures should be the other way round, cant get this loading from gallery

drmarkf
20th May 2018, 02:20 PM
My preference is to use M mode & Auto-ISO for action shots. In this mode you can also use the Function Lever to enable Exp-Comp adjustment if you know in advance that the main subject will be particularly light or dark.

It’s impossible I think to have one method that’s always best under all circumstances, and knowing and practising your setup is best whichever you go for.
I know a lot of experienced people do use manual with auto iso and I have tried it, but that doesn’t work well for me at a lot of places like Bempton Cliffs, where you’ve got birds against sky, then suddenly flying against sea and cliff, then flying from there out of the sun in to the shade of the cliff.

I usually find I’m better setting an appropriate ISO at the beginning to give me an adequate shutter speed in all of those conditions, then use AP and make all the adjustments with the exposure compensation dial. I’ve got better at predicting what compensation will work, and you’ve only got one control to move. The M1ii’s greater exposure latitude compared to the M1i I find helps a lot.

If the composition changes sufficiently to require greater depth of field I’ve got my thumb on the rear dial free to zip the aperture up immediately.

I find using the lever to switch the dial functions a fiddle (mainly because I’m very left-eye dominent and my face gets in the way).

So, I’d say find a way that seems to work for you and then practice it. Of course it’s when something major changes suddenly that the men are really sorted out from the boys (like, say, when you’ve been shooting gannets flying 25m overhead in the sun against bright clouds and you’ve closed down a stop to increase dof, and suddenly someone spots a Great Skua 100m away flying close over waves in the shade of the cliffs, and 10s later it’ll have disappeared around the headland...).

MikeOxon
21st May 2018, 09:06 AM
Itís impossible I think to have one method thatís always best under all circumstances, ..............

This is why I think it's harder for the amateur than for the professional photographer. The Pro has a specific assignment to fulfil and can set everything up with that objective in mind.

The amateur wants to capture anything interesting that happens and neither he nor his camera knows what that will be :) While it's great having a camera with loads of options, it can be very difficult to find the right one in a hurry and that's where experience and practise are so important.

I find the three C modes on the dial are one of the best additions to the M1-ii, one of which I set for BIF. My main problem is in remembering which setting is which :(

drmarkf
21st May 2018, 09:21 AM
This is why I think it's harder for the amateur than for the professional photographer. The Pro has a specific assignment to fulfil and can set everything up with that objective in mind.

The amateur wants to capture anything interesting that happens and neither he nor his camera knows what that will be :) While it's great having a camera with loads of options, it can be very difficult to find the right one in a hurry and that's where experience and practise are so important.

I find the three C modes on the dial are one of the best additions to the M1-ii, one of which I set for BIF. My main problem is in remembering which setting is which :(

Yes, thatís right about wanting to capture everything: I guess itís also true for the advanced amateur when youíve shot all the obvious stuff and youíre after specific, uncommon occurrences. Iíll let you know if I ever get there!

I should use the Cís more. I used to remember where tripod-mode (IS-off, HDR on, ISO 200 etc) was on the M1i by putting it in Memory 3 (3 for Ďtrií).

mik
21st May 2018, 10:50 AM
OK could have a bit more bite but pretty close, these where not on single point though, i used all points for these.


https://farm1.staticflickr.com/903/41530388684_291608ccf9_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/26gU6Ed)P5210135 (https://flic.kr/p/26gU6Ed) by electric.mike (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/), on Flickr


https://farm1.staticflickr.com/949/41530388664_b5d2ab3909_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/26gU6DS)P5210132 (https://flic.kr/p/26gU6DS) by electric.mike (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/), on Flickr

wornish
21st May 2018, 10:52 AM
These are very good. They move at some speed.