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Mrs T
16th January 2017, 09:48 PM
I'm not so much into New Year's Resolutions but I do like to give myself challenges through the year.

One area I want to develop is my photography and I am dipping a toe in the water and putting some images on Picfair.

I know members here have successfully completed an LRSP and thought about it before. I think it would be a big challenge and wondered how people here have approached it.

While looking at the RPS website I spotted this course: http://www.rps.org/news/2015/april/digital-photography-a-rps-and-open-university-course, and I'm not sure if it would be too basic, or a good starting point for the LRPS as it suggests.

Sorry if this is in the wrong section but I couldn't see where else to put it.

Amanda

dcbrookes
16th January 2017, 11:19 PM
I had a quick look at the RPS course you mentioned, and formed the impression that it is pretty basic. The problem with any photographic discussion or criticism online seems to me to be that it is too remote and impersonal (I would not trust any online criticism of a photograph of mine unless I knew and respected the ability and opinions of the critic). This is where belonging to a club offers advantages (or not - depending on the club!). When I achieved the ARPS distinction back in 1981 I had received a great deal of helpful feedback from fellow club members (I belonged to Tonbridge CC in Kent at the time) and from competition judges. Having said that, not everyone is within easy distance of a good club, but there is an excellent postal club called United Photographic Postfolios (which I also belonged to at the time and found very helpful).

All the above is, of course, rooted firmly in the past - my ARPS panel consisted of silver 20" x 16" monochrome prints, mostly taken on 5" x 4" film. I think, though, that the basic principle remains the same - to achieve an RPS distinction (mine has long since lapsed because I had a mid-life career change and could not afford the subscription at the time) it is necessary to decide what your "style" and subject matter is, and then rely on honest and impartial advice from trusted and experienced friends to guide and help you.

However, whatever you decide, and however you do it - good luck!

David

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 10:38 AM
Many thanks David, and you have come to the same conclusion as I did last night.

You make a good point about photos being critiqued by people whose views you trust. Also, that developing a "style" is part of the process, and I think that is something I haven't quite settled on yet. I know what I enjoy (wildlife, landscape and family pictures) so I should perhaps look there to start with.

On that basis I think I will perhaps set my own mini challenges, and become more disciplined at entering the themed competitions on this forum.

Amanda

sapper
17th January 2017, 11:09 AM
I gained my LRPS a couple of years ago. I have belonged to a few camera clubs over the years and have done reasonably well in club and interclub competitions. But, failed a PAGB submission some time ago.
So I did an "Advice Day" for my L, run by the RPS and found it very helpful.
I took their advice and got it. I would recommend that if your technique is OK.
Best of luck with it!

Naughty Nigel
17th January 2017, 11:39 AM
I think, though, that the basic principle remains the same - to achieve an RPS distinction (mine has long since lapsed because I had a mid-life career change and could not afford the subscription at the time) .......

Do these things really lapse though?

There are many similar qualifications, such as the FRCO, which allegedly lapses unless membership of the RCO is maintained, but how enforceable is that?

You have taken and passed the examination, and nobody can take that away from you.

I would say it is for more important to keep up and continue progressing with your photography, or music, or whatever the subject is.

I happen to know quite a few people who use the letters ARCO or FRCO after their names, but haven't been members for many years.

Just saying. :)

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 12:02 PM
I have learned a huge amount from my local club, which is a large one (around 190 members) and is very supportive of people doing RPS distinctions in particular. It's big enough that it has members across all genres and isn't dominated by a few members' cliques.

I think most people wanting to follow one of those paths would do well to find a club, but it has to be the right one. You have to be able to take criticism, and the club has to be able to provide constructive criticism!

I agree that the RPS and PAGB regional appraisal days are fantastic value, and you can book in as an observer for a nominal sum if you're a club member. You get to see hundreds of images and hear judges' critiques and advice.

I got a CPAGB by projected images last autumn (all taken on OMDs incidentally) and am now planning to get a printer, to learn how to use it, and then to try working up the RPS tree.

One advantage of the PAGB route is that you get to keep the letters after your name even if you don't pay an annual sub.

The PAGB and RPS systems are quite different in ethos and in the way they are assessed, and I'd be happy to discuss that if you liked (but I'm on the bottom rung of the ladder, so you really need to talk to someone who knows what they're talking about!).

steverh
17th January 2017, 12:57 PM
Hi Amanda,

If you haven't been a camera club member, I'd recommend it. There's bound to be someone there who is into whatever field of photography most interests you, you'll get loads of advice, and entering club competitions will get you started on the ladder of submitting pictures at higher levels. I'd take what some club judges say with a pinch of salt though!

It can also be very good socially - I've been a member of my club in Bristol for over 30 years. It used to be mainly oldish chaps (!) but we now have a lot more women and younger members.

I suggest going along to a few on a trial basis and see if the idea appeals.

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 12:58 PM
Thanks Dave, Naughty Nigel* and Mark. My parents are members of our local camera club but I detect some bias against m4/3 and non DSLR cameras so have never joined. Maybe I need to and prove them wrong! Also I haven't always agreed with the feedback that has been given (as relayed by my Dad so an element of interpretation).

Once again our forum has come up trumps with experience and advice.

*I always wonder why you are naughty but maybe it's best not to ask!

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 12:58 PM
Hi Amanda,

If you haven't been a camera club member, I'd recommend it. There's bound to be someone there who is into whatever field of photography most interests you, you'll get loads of advice, and entering club competitions will get you started on the ladder of submitting pictures at higher levels. I'd take what some club judges say with a pinch of salt though!

It can also be very good socially - I've been a member of my club in Bristol for over 30 years...

I suggest going along to a few on a trial basis and see if the idea appeals.

Thanks Steve.

sapper
17th January 2017, 01:06 PM
I wouldn't worry about bias agains MFT, my current club has a few MFT users. If I get any derogatory comment against MFT, I usually say something like, well I hear that canon make good photocopiers and nikon very nice binoculars :D

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 01:20 PM
There's a distinct mirrorless subculture developed in our club (Cambridge CC): one lot swapped their canikon gear for Fuji 3 - 5 years ago, and another crew who have more recently added OMDs to their canikons.

The latter are mainly sports & wildlife shooters, who understandably get the specialist value from their DSLR kit while using m4/3 for travel & general photography.

The club is pleasantly non-gearist, actually, and m4/3's cause has been helped by a couple of prominent and highly-skilled members who have become strong advocates and get regular wins and places in local competitions.

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 01:29 PM
If anyone's interested, here are 3 of those Olympus advocates in our club: with people like this around, m4/3 doesn't get too much ridicule!

http://www.minds-eye.org.uk/

http://www.cambridgephotography.co.uk/

https://plus.google.com/117912637026952647148 (Clive's main site seems to be down, but you get the idea)

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 01:49 PM
I wouldn't worry about bias agains MFT, my current club has a few MFT users. If I get any derogatory comment against MFT, I usually say something like, well I hear that canon make good photocopiers and nikon very nice binoculars :D

*chr Love it! :D

iso
17th January 2017, 06:52 PM
Never been a member of a Club. Going back then, it always seemed they had a reputation for being - well Club like.
I guess I am not a joiner, but should I?

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 07:28 PM
That's what puts me off, and Mr T saying he did have that experience in the past! I prefer to do my own thing, but then do I miss out?

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 07:56 PM
At all costs you need to avoid the nerdy fleece-people *zzz

...and the techy control-freaks :eek: :eek: :eek:

That's one advantage of trying larger clubs - it increases your chances of finding a sub-group with whom you can identify. There are loads of clubs everywhere, so you're bound to have several to try. Inevitably there's a high proportion of 60-ish recent retirees in all clubs, but some of us are actually quite pleasant to know...

From what I hear, both gender & age balances have improved in most clubs over the past few years *chr

Mrs T
17th January 2017, 08:09 PM
But what if that is my dream demographic??? :eek:

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 08:21 PM
But what if that is my dream demographic??? :eek:

Well, in that case you won't be, errrmmm, disappointed...

Naughty Nigel
17th January 2017, 09:09 PM
I wouldn't worry about bias agains MFT, my current club has a few MFT users. If I get any derogatory comment against MFT, I usually say something like, well I hear that canon make good photocopiers and nikon very nice binoculars :D

I don't lose any sleep over it at all. :)

I find it bizarre that a camera club, where members presumably own more than one camera each, can become so feudal about a particular type or brand of camera. *???

I am under no illusions that 43 has its limitations. All cameras do. But most things in life are a compromise, and 43 is one that I am very happy to accept.

My son has recently bought a new full frame Nikon, and I have to say the image quality, especially in low light, is stunning. But it is actually bigger and heavier than my Mamiya 645 (which is still the better camera in my view), so it would hardly be suitable for my needs involving regular air travel.

I also find it bizarre that photographers will revere (say) a Contax or Leica 35 mm film camera, but will look down their noses at a 43 camera that produces far better image quality than can be extracted from 35 mm film!

Unfortunately I also have a keen interest in HiFi, and that is just as bad. :mad:

Naughty Nigel
17th January 2017, 09:14 PM
Inevitably there's a high proportion of 60-ish recent retirees in all clubs, but some of us are actually quite pleasant to know...

That particular demographic has a lot to answer for in my view, and not just in camera clubs. :rolleyes:

drmarkf
17th January 2017, 10:09 PM
That particular demographic has a lot to answer for in my view, and not just in camera clubs. :rolleyes:

Yup, we presumably bred you, squire :D :D :D

DerekW
17th January 2017, 10:59 PM
Nigel - What is your Hifi kit?

sapper
18th January 2017, 08:41 AM
You mazy be missing out. Clubs are no all the same, some are friendly, helpful, some are not so. It may be that there is some choice where you are, why not visit one or two if that is the case?

Naughty Nigel
18th January 2017, 12:24 PM
Yup, we presumably bred you, squire :D :D :D

I don't think so Mark. I fit very neatly into that demographic myself nowadays, although I am not retired, and thanks to Gordon Brown I doubt that I ever will. But then I enjoy my work, so I'm happy to wend my way onwards. :)

Naughty Nigel
18th January 2017, 12:50 PM
Nigel - What is your Hifi kit?

Most of it is quintessentially British, with odd Dutch and Japanese components thrown in.

I have various systems in different rooms, but my main system in the Parlour comprises a Philips CD960 CD player, a Quad FM4 tuner, a Quad 34 Preamp, and a choice of either a Quad 606 II power amp, or a pair of Quad II valve amps. The latter are a family heirloom, and are even older than I am!

Loudspeakers are Quad 22L floor standers; some of the last built in Huntingdon. I would love a pair of ESL's, but they would take up far too much space. We could move the idiot's lantern I suppose, but I don't think management, or junior management would be happy about that! :)

I also have a Philips GA212 record deck, which was by far the best they made in my view. It has a Linn K9 cartridge in it at the moment, which works well, but I also have a Shure V15 Mk 3 somewhere in a spare headshell. I bought the record deck ex-demo with my first month's wages back in 1974, so as much as I would like a Linn deck I would be reluctant to part with the Philips.

Then upstairs in my study I have the same Quad FM4 and 34 but with a 306 power amp; which must the about the ultimate 'compact sound system', and fits perfectly into the top of a small Ikea bookcase. This is driven by a Rotel 965 BX CD player, (very similar to the Philips), and uses a pair of Quad 12L loudspeakers.

Don't ask me what the interconnects are though. They are just good quality wires that connect the various components together, and make no difference to the sound whatsoever. Anybody who tells you otherwise is talking bovine poo. :D

Mrs T
18th January 2017, 02:13 PM
You mazy be missing out. Clubs are no all the same, some are friendly, helpful, some are not so. It may be that there is some choice where you are, why not visit one or two if that is the case?

Thanks Dave. I seem to remember that you did successfully compete an LRPS.

DerekW
18th January 2017, 04:26 PM
RE NN list of kit - very impressive, I would think that you could be the home of the Quad fan club.

sad to say I sold a Quad pre and power amp in the early 80s to get a Nakamichi cassette player.

I remember an excellent demo at the Quad stand in the early 70s, the electrostatics were putting out a fine sound.

pdk42
18th January 2017, 04:51 PM
RE NN list of kit - very impressive, I would think that you could be the home of the Quad fan club.

sad to say I sold a Quad pre and power amp in the early 80s to get a Nakamichi cassette player.

I remember an excellent demo at the Quad stand in the early 70s, the electrostatics were putting out a fine sound.

I run a Quad 33/303 that I bought in 1978 with my first wages from a summer job I did with Nat West Bank. I've had to replace the smoothing electrolytics over the years but other than that it's worked faultlessly from the start. Made in Huntingdon too - a town I subsequently worked in for about 10 years.

Naughty Nigel
18th January 2017, 05:10 PM
RE NN list of kit - very impressive, I would think that you could be the home of the Quad fan club.

I remember an excellent demo at the Quad stand in the early 70s, the electrostatics were putting out a fine sound.

As I explained, the Quad II's were a family heirloom, originally bought in 1955 from Shorts in London for the princely sum of 27/10/6d each including Purchase Tax! Quad II's are now selling for silly money on eBay, but I wouldn't part with them.

Some of my Quad 34's/FM4's and 306's were non-operational or faulty when I bought them, as I enjoy getting the soldering iron, signal generator and oscilloscope out, and bringing equipment back to life.

One of the joys of electronics from this era is that virtually everything can be replaced; unlike the surface mount technology nowadays. And it sounds very good too!

(I should add that Quad Huntingdon still service and repair all of their equipment of any age, and for reasonable prices; which is something that no Japanese or Chinese manufacturers can boast!)

I love the sound of the Quad electrostatics; especially the mid-range and treble, but they lack bass and sheer volume, even with powerful amplifiers. I find the Quad 22L's remarkably good, with excellent bass, which is more than capable of reproducing the fulsome sound of 32' organ pipes without the need for a sub-woofer (which I regard as heresy)! :D

DerekW
18th January 2017, 06:47 PM
Re HiFi - I started with Leak and Spendor - so good UK stuff - I met both the Hughes, (the designers and founders of the company) at various events and a visit to the factory to get the BC1s updated with a new set of drivers - the speaker had "cone sag"

I was then went to Musical Fidelity for a while and some relatively large speakers by KEF, and now I have Naim electronics and Wilson Benesch speakers.

Rather a sad story really, Hifi and photography competing for my money (along with travel).

iso
18th January 2017, 06:58 PM
Hijacked again - I thought we were talking about the value or otherwise of being a member of a camera club - and does it add to life or just be a mirror image of all that c.ap:mad:

DerekW
18th January 2017, 07:02 PM
oops sorry

Naughty Nigel
18th January 2017, 09:17 PM
Hijacked again ....

I think 'derailed' is a better term. Is this a cue to talk about trains. :D

DerekW
18th January 2017, 10:50 PM
it could be the equivalent of the get together in the pub after the club meeting.

steverh
18th January 2017, 10:56 PM
Amanda - trying to get more or less back on topic!

I'd still suggest trying a few clubs and don't give up if the first one is no good. There is one large club in the Bristol area which has the reputation of being very standoffish if you are not an FRPS or better :rolleyes: (pm if you want to know)

iso
19th January 2017, 05:29 PM
I think 'derailed' is a better term. Is this a cue to talk about trains. :D

Gotta shunt that one into the Sidings:p

Seriously folks - I for one would like to hear the teams view on Clubs.
I must admit I am fearful, as it sounds Mrs T is.
A feeling which I have to say is reinforced when very occasionally travelling round the nether regions of the UK, I call into some local club exhibition on a Saturday in the Town Hall. Hollowed Ground sends me scuttling off.:eek:

Naughty Nigel
19th January 2017, 05:49 PM
Gotta shunt that one into the Sidings:p

I think you have given a clear enough signal there ISO. :D

Seriously folks - I for one would like to hear the teams view on Clubs.
I must admit I am fearful, as it sounds Mrs T is.
A feeling which I have to say is reinforced when very occasionally travelling round the nether regions of the UK, I call into some local club exhibition on a Saturday in the Town Hall. Hollowed Ground sends me scuttling off.:eek:

I must admit I haven't darkened the doors of a camera club for many years now. Maybe (hopefully) things have changed, but I can remember being made to feel unworthy to walk on the hallowed ground, whilst the humble Pentax MX that I owned at the time was looked down on with some disdain. (I'm not sure whether it was the Pentax name or MX model that was the problem.)

All of the 'real' photographers were using Leica's, Nikons or medium format rangefinders. It didn't seem to register with these people that the ultimate arbiter of quality was the film itself, which was the same for everyone. (I accept that Nikon and Zeiss glass is good, but it isn't that that much better than Pentax glass surely, especially given that I was young enough to have steady hands? :) )

All in all I found the whole atmosphere unhelpful and unwelcoming. I was keen on motorsports photography at the time, which probably didn't help, but I think some members also took a dim view of me not only developing E6 films myself, but I also printed them onto Cibachrome, which being colour wasn't 'proper' photography at all. :rolleyes:

Oh, and there were the slide shows. *zzz*zzz*zzz*zzz*zzz

iso
19th January 2017, 06:41 PM
Hey - could a Poll be set up to see how many members are Members of Clubs Yes/No. Then maybe drill down to find reasons/likes/dislikes?? Could be of very useful help to us all????

sapper
19th January 2017, 06:50 PM
Trotting out the old negative cliches from years is hardly going to encourage someone to visit a club.
Camera clubs these days are more representative of the population as a whole, unlike the days of old males with Leicas, Rollies ETC.
I belong to two clubs with a good mix of the sexes. A few twenty somethings, but not like the club I belonged to in Ripon in the 60's.
Maybe the answer Amanda is to suck it and see.

Mrs T
19th January 2017, 08:19 PM
Amanda - trying to get more or less back on topic!

I'd still suggest trying a few clubs and don't give up if the first one is no good. There is one large club in the Bristol area which has the reputation of being very standoffish if you are not an FRPS or better :rolleyes: (pm if you want to know)

Thanks Steve. If I do try then I'd try local first.

Also, iso, Naughty Nigel and sapper for your comments.

I think next time I have a week off and can free up the evening by swimming in the morning instead of the evening (and avoid the camera club clash) I might try it. Having said that it will have to be very good to tempt me away from the swimming pool!

Naughty Nigel
19th January 2017, 08:54 PM
Thanks Steve. If I do try then I'd try local first.

Also, iso, Naughty Nigel and sapper for your comments.

I think next time I have a week off and can free up the evening by swimming in the morning instead of the evening (and avoid the camera club clash) I might try it. Having said that it will have to be very good to tempt me away from the swimming pool!

Do you know any photographers locally?

Depending on how you get on with your local camera club(s) you might find it helpful to spend time with one or two photographic friends. I always enjoy photographic expeditions with my son as it helps us both to see things in ways that we might not have done otherwise.

Sorry to be so negative about camera club bores, but some experiences leave scars for life :)

Mrs T
20th January 2017, 08:58 PM
That's OK Nigel, my husband feels the same.

Actually I have high regard for my Dad and have already learnt a lot from him, so maybe I have expertise right on the doorstep!

Crazy Dave
21st January 2017, 08:21 AM
Hi Amanda. Rather late coming to this but why not give a club a go? Most if not all will allow a couple of evenings as a guest so that you can get the feel of it and the people. Maybe have a look at the club's web site to choose an evening where the content is of interest to you.

Clubs vary. At the first we tried several years ago, we became invisible and left after a few weeks. We joined a second and have made friendships that we value greatly. It's full of knowledgable, warm people who share their expertise. And the first club we hear is now thriving and has a wait list for new members.

What's to lose? The reality is not very much and you may strike lucky.


David

Mrs T
21st January 2017, 03:36 PM
Thanks Crazy Dave. I have had a look and it looks like they charge for visitors which is a bit disappointing. But I'll keep it in mind.

iso
21st January 2017, 07:29 PM
Hi T.
As a result of all this I searched a few Clubs in my area. Some definitely gave off the 'no-no' feeling, which I guess just reinforced a prejudice. One I thought I might try. But I don't know. As you implied, one is either a 'joiner' or 'maybe a joiner', or just prefer something else.

So far the pro- club Posts on this Thread have not exactly been convincing:(

sapper
21st January 2017, 07:38 PM
I suppose it depends on what you want from a club.
I want sociability, help to improve my work through competitions and appraisals, hands on evenings and outings.
It may be worth looking at the objects of s potential club. One of my clubs has this on the first page of our website, "Our aim is to promote the art of photo imagery."
Nothing about sociability. My other has this, "Do you want to improve your photographic skills in a friendly community environment? Then youve come to the right place. 'Its the friendliest club I have been to' and 'Hadleigh Camera Club has Compact Camerahelped me become a better photographer' are typical of the comments made. '
The proof will be in the reception given to a visitor.

I like both my clubs, have made friends in both.

Mrs T
21st January 2017, 08:29 PM
Hi T.
As a result of all this I searched a few Clubs in my area. Some definitely gave off the 'no-no' feeling, which I guess just reinforced a prejudice. One I thought I might try. But I don't know. As you implied, one is either a 'joiner' or 'maybe a joiner', or just prefer something else.

So far the pro- club Posts on this Thread have not exactly been convincing:(

Thanks iso. I have been pleased to hear that some people do find them a good place to be. I did look at the programme that the club offered and in conjunction with things I've heard my parent's say it didn't inspire me. I might cast the net a bit further, but I think for me working full time, swimming and gym six times a week and keeping in touch with family and friends something else would have to go! As the swimming and gym generally release tension at the end of the day I'm not sure a camera club might be so therapeutic! And you are right on your inference.

iso
23rd January 2017, 07:19 PM
Thanks iso. I have been pleased to hear that some people do find them a good place to be. I did look at the programme that the club offered and in conjunction with things I've heard my parent's say it didn't inspire me. I might cast the net a bit further, but I think for me working full time, swimming and gym six times a week and keeping in touch with family and friends something else would have to go! As the swimming and gym generally release tension at the end of the day I'm not sure a camera club might be so therapeutic! And you are right on your inference.

As someone said earlier, Clubs 'propositions' do vary. Their Programmes tell a lot, (endless competitions, only active between Sept - May, etc). I am a bit tied up until March, but say what, why don't we both go to ONE club and compare experiences?

So far in this Thread, there has not been a lot to sway the voter either way:)*yes

Mrs T
23rd January 2017, 07:27 PM
Yeah, OK that sounds like a plan. But I might have to wait until my week off in April!

drmarkf
23rd January 2017, 07:33 PM
Well, here's my local club's main evening programme: one would hope that at least with a big club you'd get a good mix of formal evening sessions -

http://www.cambcc.org.uk/programme

As well as this for the whole club, there are monthly specialist group sessions - 'Portrait', 'New Members', 'Digital Techniques', 'Aperture' (for more advanced members development, including PAGB/RPS submissions, personal projects etc) and an 'Out and About' group who arrange outings to photography shows, wildlife venues, nearby cities for street walks etc etc. Anyone can join these.

Quite frankly, if someone couldn't find something to justify membership with that lot on offer I think they would indeed be a lot better off staying home, but there we are...

Mrs T
23rd January 2017, 07:46 PM
That does look good. This is ours:

http://www.thornburycameraclub.co.uk/programme.html

which if I'm honest doesn't inspire me much!

drmarkf
23rd January 2017, 08:32 PM
Yes, I must say for me it's the monthly specialist sessions that I really enjoy and learn from.

I realise that I've forgotten some: monthly there's also the 'Wednesday Workshop' group who arrange evening practical sessions, like astrophotography, flash, tabletop photography and macro.

Then, 3-4 times a year there are 'Beginning to end' days held at several venues when you can book in to spend the whole day learning a topic and then producing a set of images. A group of 4 of us Olympus users in the club used one of these last year to get to grips with focus stacking and bracketing, and very useful it was in fighting our way together through the convoluted menu systems to switch these on!

Mrs T
23rd January 2017, 09:01 PM
It does look like a good programme.

iso
24th January 2017, 06:15 PM
Yes, I must say for me it's the monthly specialist sessions that I really enjoy and learn from.

I realise that I've forgotten some: monthly there's also the 'Wednesday Workshop' group who arrange evening practical sessions, like astrophotography, flash, tabletop photography and macro.

Then, 3-4 times a year there are 'Beginning to end' days held at several venues when you can book in to spend the whole day learning a topic and then producing a set of images. A group of 4 of us Olympus users in the club used one of these last year to get to grips with focus stacking and bracketing, and very useful it was in fighting our way together through the convoluted menu systems to switch these on!

All that's ok Mark. You look lucky to have a Club like that. But not all offer what yours does - and - frankly there hasn't been enough responses, either way, to decide the Issue.
Still Mrs T and me will be trying 'Clubbing' out, and we will report back -maybe:cool:

Mrs T
24th January 2017, 07:27 PM
And of course anyone else who fancies trying clubbing is welcome to join in!

iso
25th January 2017, 07:03 PM
Bump - As in Clubbing:)