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paullus
2nd November 2013, 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian http://e-group.uk.net/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://e-group.uk.net/forum/showthread.php?p=260112#post260112)
You won't get a free grip or MMF-3 with this deal.

Ian



Quote:
Originally Posted by BarD-Art http://e-group.uk.net/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://e-group.uk.net/forum/showthread.php?p=261118#post261118)
Hello,

I'm new to this forum but just wanted to share my experience of buying E-M1 + mZD12-40mm from Panamoz.
I ordered the kit on Tuesday afternoon. I've paid via Paypal (1450) but they didn't charged me straight away, it was only authorisation of the payment. The next day I got an e-mail with UPS tracking number and the money has been taken from my account. I got the camera and lens yesterday afternoon. The invoice on the outside of the box states 'Sample toy accessory' worth $69 ;-) Inside I've found a Panamoz warranty card (2 years) with reference nr. In case of a repair/exchange I balieve one has to send the equipment back to Panamoz UK contact address and from there is't being send back to HK for repair/replacement.
Anyway I'm a happy customer now :-D

Kind regards,

Bartek

************************************************** *******************

I'm sorry if this message is partly duplicated in another thread but it appears to have been overlooked.
I feel very strongly about this situation which is starting to stink.
The E-M1 12-40 kit is now available through companies such as Amazon and Panamoz who are selling it at much cheaper prices. At the same time mugs like me have paid as much as 572.49 more and are still waiting. The thing is with Amazon though is they have a price promise for pre orders. If the price is less on release than originally advertised they honour the lower price.
Ian you point out that the free grip and adapter won't be available with these cheaper deals. To buy them separately from well known online stores would only cost 348 still saving me 224.49
So can we expect a discount from Olympus? Here's hoping.

There is something morally wrong about this. How can Olympus allow these huge discounts before people who've paid full price well in advance get their orders?

Ian I have to direct this to you as I'm getting not satisfaction from Olympus themselves.
In light of what I've said above give me one good reason why I shouldn't cancel my order with the Olympus shop and save a load of hard earned cash by ordering from somewhere else?

Steve

magicaxeman
2nd November 2013, 02:32 PM
Olympus don't allow them, whats happening is that these grey import companies bypass paying tax (in the UK import duty & VAT) as well as taking advantage of exchange rates that combined see a significant reduction compared to the UK retail price.

The down sides are that you effectively have no warranty with olympus or any other brand they are selling, your warranty rests with the company you bought from alone.
It also means that not only are any current offers not available to you but also that you will not get the Pro service from olympus on the EM1.

I'm all for saving a few quid and some of the prices are very tempting but these grey import companies are causing a major decline in our retail photography industry, even on line retailers cant compete with them, yet it is often these retailers and the brand company such as olympus that buyers then expect to sort things out when their camera goes wrong.

I looked at panamoz last night.. £1377 for the EM1 - 12-40 kit compared to a uk price of £1299 for the body alone... I wont touch it with a barge pole, I want the full olympus back up for my camera and would rather pay more for that and to ensure my local camera shop stays open.

photo_owl
2nd November 2013, 02:35 PM
In light of what I've said above give me one good reason why I shouldn't cancel my order with the Olympus shop and save a load of hard earned cash by ordering from somewhere else?

Steve

absolutely nothing to stop you doing this.

the obvious 'reasons' would be that you will not have an Olympus EU warranty and are liable for around 300 duty - but if these aren't a concern for you then you should clearly go that route.

Olympus EU can't do anything about such practices, or the supply aspect - they will have put in their initial order in the same way as Olympus divisions worldwide (and re-orders!) so they have no control at this point on units outwith their market.

I have no doubt that there will be even more internal discussions over the distribution of units to firms that subsequently market across border - but fundamentally they cannot fully control such practices through anything but local market pricing, offers and warranty. They certainly aren't alone in having such issues!

paullus
2nd November 2013, 02:49 PM
I understand the pitfall of grey imports perfectly well.
The point I'm trying to make is why have Olympus released the camera to such companies when they have the money of people who ordered them weeks ago in the bank. I ordered mine in the expectation that I would be an early adopter for which I was prepared to pay the premium price. I did not expect to see the camera being discounted before I even received it!
Pre-orders should have been honoured before the camera was put on general release. Am I the only one who feels a great sense of injustice?

Steve

DavyG
2nd November 2013, 03:23 PM
I understand the pitfall of grey imports perfectly well.
The point I'm trying to make is why have Olympus released the camera to such companies when they have the money of people who ordered them weeks ago in the bank. I ordered mine in the expectation that I would be an early adopter for which I was prepared to pay the premium price. I did not expect to see the camera being discounted before I even received it!
Pre-orders should have been honoured before the camera was put on general release. Am I the only one who feels a great sense of injustice?

Steve

I don't believe the camera is being discounted, I think the suppliers are simply avoiding import duty and VAT.

In addition, some cameras cost less abroad, look at the price of an E-M1 in the USA, it's almost the same in US $ as it is in UK , this doesn't mean the US camera is discounted, it's a result of regional and taxation differences.

Dave

photo_owl
2nd November 2013, 03:28 PM
I understand the pitfall of grey imports perfectly well.
The point I'm trying to make is why have Olympus released the camera to such companies when they have the money of people who ordered them weeks ago in the bank. I ordered mine in the expectation that I would be an early adopter for which I was prepared to pay the premium price. I did not expect to see the camera being discounted before I even received it!
Pre-orders should have been honoured before the camera was put on general release. Am I the only one who feels a great sense of injustice?

Steve

if you mean that this distributor is able to provide these (12-40) units before Olympus EU can ship to either their distributors or via the online shop pre orders - then I agree.

personally I felt I had to make a decision between a body only or the uncertain delivery of the 12-40 kits relative to the initial dates on the grip offer and was frustrated when the offer was subsequently confirmed to apply regardless of when the units shipped (yes a date was put in place after than indicative statement but that was the principle). The outcome being that I had the comfort of body with grip and adapter but am going to end up paying even more for my eventual combination than the 1950, let alone the 1450 indicated in this post!!!!!

Chris Pattison
2nd November 2013, 03:31 PM
I believe it is the UK government that needs to take a look at this. There has been a terrible disparity between UK prices and US/Far East prices for too long.

On the subject of Panamoz, a friend of mine bought a silver OM-D from there shortly after its introduction. 11 months later it developed a sensor problem. He returned the camera and received a replacement within days with no hassle.
Also, with Panamoz there is no duty to pay.

Much cheaper, excellent returns service, no duty - all hard to resist.

Chris

Westy
2nd November 2013, 03:52 PM
Not being one to judge but whichever way you look at it, by not paying vat when it is required to do so is illegal. Just because you haven't been asked for it doesn't make it ok.:confused:

Gwyver
2nd November 2013, 04:10 PM
Further to the point that Paul (Westy) makes - if UK customs chance upon the package and discover it's true contents/value when it arrives for customs clearance it will be confiscated - to be released only after payment of the import duty + a surcharge.
Caveat emptor!

MarkG
2nd November 2013, 04:14 PM
I think the clue is in the packaging describing it as a toy worth a fraction of the price. But even ignoring the vat and import duty, us UK customers pay a lot more than USA and Far East.

I researched bringing in gear from abroad and there is a 390 limit from outside the EU. Then VAT applies, and import duty too.

bredman
2nd November 2013, 04:27 PM
Not being one to judge but whichever way you look at it, by not paying vat when it is required to do so is illegal. Just because you haven't been asked for it doesn't make it ok.:confused:

I was once told by a customs agent that if stuff gets through folk should consider themselves lucky in the game. We were talking about stuff with the correct values on the customs slip -- occasionally they get through. If people are prepared to mark parcels as low value gifts then that's their business.

I quite like the fact the customs don't open packages to value the contents. I hope it stays this way. There is enough state intrusion/regulation in our lives. If someone gets something cheaper than me so what, no sour grapes in my corner.

Chris Pattison
2nd November 2013, 04:32 PM
I do agree we should make a contribution to the government's coffers, and should not tax dodge, but when tax laws are threatening UK based business because grey imports are so temptingly cheap, something needs to be done.

jamsa
2nd November 2013, 04:33 PM
I understand the pitfall of grey imports perfectly well.
The point I'm trying to make is why have Olympus released the camera to such companies when they have the money of people who ordered them weeks ago in the bank. I ordered mine in the expectation that I would be an early adopter for which I was prepared to pay the premium price. I did not expect to see the camera being discounted before I even received it!
Pre-orders should have been honoured before the camera was put on general release. Am I the only one who feels a great sense of injustice?

Steve

It also is annoying to see "surplus" stock being sold off the shelf in the UK and abroad whilst others are still waiting on stock and especially if they paid up front... Olympus chose to supply who gets what and so why are some still waiting in a queue when others can just pop along to a retailer and buy one with no prepayment etc... Kind of stinks of poor distribution, poor decisions and a lack of thought..ie any retailer with outstanding orders should have had those fulfilled before "shelf stock" elsewhere...There might have been some hedge betting by ordering in more than one location but this wont have been many as they might have risked being charged for more than one.

photo_owl
2nd November 2013, 04:36 PM
I think the clue is in the packaging describing it as a toy worth a fraction of the price. But even ignoring the vat and import duty, us UK customers pay a lot more than USA and Far East.

I researched bringing in gear from abroad and there is a 390 limit from outside the EU. Then VAT applies, and import duty too.

yep - if you physically bring in goods you have this significant limit, but for the sake of clarity in the context of this thread, if you have goods sent I believe it's 15 (or 36 for a gift).

DerekW
2nd November 2013, 04:42 PM
Cost discrepancy between the UK and the rest of the world has been with us for a long time.
A combination of higher costs to run a business in the UK, relatively low volume of sales and socialist tendency to prevent people having things and enjoying them (regardless of party in government)

This happens for most imported products be it software, electronics, cameras etc.

Either put up with it or import the goods directly and pay the duty - in most cases you come out ahead of buying local.

As for warranty issues, if the product is so unreliable that it is going to fail within the extended warranty period (if it was bought local) then should you really be buying the product?.

photo_owl
2nd November 2013, 04:45 PM
It also is annoying to see "surplus" stock being sold off the shelf in the UK and abroad whilst others are still waiting on stock and especially if they paid up front... Olympus chose to supply who gets what and so why are some still waiting in a queue when others can just pop along to a retailer and buy one with no prepayment etc... Kind of stinks of poor distribution, poor decisions and a lack of thought..ie any retailer with outstanding orders should have had those fulfilled before "shelf stock" elsewhere...There might have been some hedge betting by ordering in more than one location but this wont have been many as they might have risked being charged for more than one.

don't understand what you are saying? distributors will have committed to intial/pre orders (these will have been based on a combination of customer pre-orders and whatever judgement/stock they considered at the time) in the same way as any individual could pre-order any number of units.

how these get into individual hands isn't an Olympus issue with any fragrance :confused:

I don't see any suggestion to date that Olympus have met re-orders prior to meeting pre-orders - do you know better?

banjukes
2nd November 2013, 05:58 PM
Olympus has no control over imports or shelf stock. Personally, if importing I'd keep the right side of the law and pay the duty. Unfortunately supply hasn't nearly met with demand in the UK but it's getting there and I'm sure Olympus are doing their best to sort that out ASAP. Certainly, from the shots I have been seeing here on the forum, it's well worth the wait. Buy local if at all possible and support your local dealer. Shortly all members waiting on their new E-M1's will have taken delivery of their cameras and be delighted with their purchases. The waiting will matter no more, Olympus will be forgiven and the bashing will stop.

TonyR
2nd November 2013, 06:47 PM
I for one won't ever be buying anything from the Olympus shop again.

benvendetta
2nd November 2013, 07:37 PM
Just had A look at the Paramoz site. Certainly very attractive prices. They seem to offer their own 2 year warranty but surely the kits would have a 12 month international one anyway. Or am I missing something? You won't be able to claim the feebies though. Also looked at Amazon but the price is the same as all the UK dealers. I will stand by my order with LCE.

G2EWS
2nd November 2013, 08:01 PM
We used to call people like this barrack room lawyers. Ie those who sprout the law, but have no knowledge of it.

Totally defeats me the rubbish that is being spoken about.

But hey ho, each is entitled to say what they want even if they have no knowledge!

Regards

Chris

David M
2nd November 2013, 09:09 PM
While you're reading this Ian, would it be possible to add an 'Add to Ignore List' link to the list below a users post?

timd1230
2nd November 2013, 09:48 PM
Sorry but I thought customs and excise fraud was quite clear in the eyes of the law - Its not the sender of the goods that is liable for the tax or duty it is the Importer (YOU) If you believe goods you have purchased have not had the correct duty paid (e.g you don't have the paperwork or cannot produce the paperwork or an appropriate audit trail ) you need to be making a declaration and payment to HRMC - The company sending the item even if understated or wrongly declared is committing no offence but YOU are.

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sentencing_manual/evasion_of_excise_duty_with_intent_to_defraud_her_ majesty/

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/reportingfraud/help.htm

Now in the case of the body / lens there is close to £400 of vat at full uk RRP so everyone else down the line makes their profit and the buyer is the only person committing a crime - No price discounting by the foreign supplier just good old fashioned tax evasion.

Harbrimar
2nd November 2013, 10:19 PM
Much has been said about advantages/disadvantages of grey imports and I entirely agree. Clearly if you chose to import from the far east and not pay import duty you are going to get the item far cheaper but you are committing a criminal offence.

Olympus have decided that their marketing strategy is to release the product in the far east before Europe and there will always be firms and/or individuals who will seek to make a quick profit by exporting from Hong Kong to Europe but that is hardly the fault of Olympus Europe.

I took the opportunity to buy when Amazon UK recently advertised the EM-1 & 12-40 mm at a reduced price (it was only available for a few hours I think). But once again, you cannot blame Olympus as Amazon has a huge amount of buying power and can afford to use such a strategy to attract customers. Clearly, the larger suppliers are going to get their slice of cake before some of the smaller firms. Finally, my EM-1 is being supplied by Amazon EU and not through their 'market place' and unlikely to be a grey product.

G2EWS
2nd November 2013, 10:19 PM
Sorry but I thought customs and excise fraud was quite clear in the eyes of the law - Its not the sender of the goods that is liable for the tax or duty it is the Importer (YOU) If you believe goods you have purchased have not had the correct duty paid (e.g you don't have the paperwork or cannot produce the paperwork or an appropriate audit trail ) you need to be making a declaration and payment to HRMC - The company sending the item even if understated or wrongly declared is committing no offence but YOU are.

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sentencing_manual/evasion_of_excise_duty_with_intent_to_defraud_her_ majesty/

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/reportingfraud/help.htm

Now in the case of the body / lens there is close to 400 of vat at full uk RRP so everyone else down the line makes their profit and the buyer is the only person committing a crime - No price discounting by the foreign supplier just good old fashioned tax evasion.

Oh dear, another case of no knowledge.

Never mind!

Regards

Chris

Stu
2nd November 2013, 10:37 PM
Oh dear, another case of no knowledge.

Never mind!

Regards

Chris

This is taken from the HMRC website:

Who is responsible for the information on the declaration?

If you are ordering or sending any goods from abroad, you - as the importer of goods - are legally responsible for the information on the Customs Declaration and for any charges due.

If you're ordering goods remotely, for example over the Internet or by mail order, it is in your own interest to make sure that the sender abroad makes a complete and accurate declaration.

If you're sending goods from abroad to the UK, then the recipient is legally responsible for the information on the Customs Declaration.

If no declaration is made, or the information is inaccurate, the package may be delayed whilst the UKBA makes further enquiries, and in some cases, the package and its contents may be seized.

paullus
3rd November 2013, 12:04 AM
I took the opportunity to buy when Amazon UK recently advertised the EM-1 & 12-40 mm at a reduced price (it was only available for a few hours I think). But once again, you cannot blame Olympus as Amazon has a huge amount of buying power and can afford to use such a strategy to attract customers. Clearly, the larger suppliers are going to get their slice of cake before some of the smaller firms. Finally, my EM-1 is being supplied by Amazon EU and not through their 'market place' and unlikely to be a grey product.

Can I very politely ask people to look at my original post as this thread like many others has been side-tracked. I don't give a hoot about grey imports and their legality in this instance.
My point once again is simply this, Olympus have taken money from many people such as I who pre-ordered directly from the UK Olympus shop. Regardless of this they have failed to honour these orders before releasing stock to companies such as Amazon UK who are now selling at discounted prices.
When I ordered my 12-40 kit I did not expect to see it being sold significantly cheaper by a UK vendor before I'd actually received mine. What was the point of pre-ordering?

Steve

Stu
3rd November 2013, 01:20 AM
Can I very politely ask people to look at my original post as this thread like many others has been side-tracked. I don't give a hoot about grey imports and their legality in this instance.
My point once again is simply this, Olympus have taken money from many people such as I who pre-ordered directly from the UK Olympus shop. Regardless of this they have failed to honour these orders before releasing stock to companies such as Amazon UK who are now selling at discounted prices.
When I ordered my 12-40 kit I did not expect to see it being sold significantly cheaper by a UK vendor before I'd actually received mine. What was the point of pre-ordering?

Steve

The discounted price on Amazon with the 12-40mm is not being sold by Amazon but by EC CRESCENT *Worldwide Shipping* which is not a UK vendor. We have not been side tracked.

Stu
3rd November 2013, 01:26 AM
Another price is from a company in Japan.

The price Amazon is selling for cannot be supplied at the moment. It is showing as a 1 to 4 month wait. Olympus UK has no control over what price Amazon UK sell for but in this instance they don't even have it in stock.

benvendetta
3rd November 2013, 07:04 AM
Another price is from a company in Japan.

The price Amazon is selling for cannot be supplied at the moment. It is showing as a 1 to 4 month wait. Olympus UK has no control over what price Amazon UK sell for but in this instance they don't even have it in stock.

Says 6 to 10 days at the moment..............

theMusicMan
3rd November 2013, 07:39 AM
Interesting thread...


Oh dear, another case of no knowledge.

Never mind!

Regards

Chris

Chris... please consider adding value to the thread with your interpretation of what the law is. Your contributions here are simply stating that apparently you know the law, and that some people here don't! Please add value to the thread as I am sure people are interested.

Phill D
3rd November 2013, 08:11 AM
John you just put my thoughts into words very nicely well done. I for one would be interested. Also in instances like this it would be good if posters would give a little personal information so readers could see what background expertise posters have for their points.

G2EWS
3rd November 2013, 08:14 AM
Interesting thread...




Chris... please consider adding value to the thread with your interpretation of what the law is. Your contributions here are simply stating that apparently you know the law, and that some people here don't! Please add value to the thread as I am sure people are interested.

Hi John,

Very good point. I have already done this and got nowhere (do remember there are two threads along the lines of this one!).

At the end of the day as mentioned elsewhere people have to make their own decisions based on what they believe in.

All I can do is point out what I know and others can deal with it as they see fit. So many people seem to be picking bits out of the legal jargon and using that alone, that is fine if it keeps them happy.

So forgive me for bowing out of these conversations, something I never do, but you can only hit your head against a wall so many times.

Which brings me neatly to a final point. If I have offended anybody, it was not intended, but just my frustration at having to repeat myself. I must say that I have been mightily impressed by the lack of abuse that you often get on other forums, which is the reason I rarely visit them anymore. Do like this one though.

Best regards


Chris

Stu
3rd November 2013, 08:42 AM
Says 6 to 10 days at the moment..............

That is not being sold by Amazon UK though. It clearly states:

EC CRESCENT *Worldwide Shipping*

Stu
3rd November 2013, 08:47 AM
Hi John,

Very good point. I have already done this and got nowhere (do remember there are two threads along the lines of this one!).

At the end of the day as mentioned elsewhere people have to make their own decisions based on what they believe in.

All I can do is point out what I know and others can deal with it as they see fit. So many people seem to be picking bits out of the legal jargon and using that alone, that is fine if it keeps them happy.

So forgive me for bowing out of these conversations, something I never do, but you can only hit your head against a wall so many times.

Which brings me neatly to a final point. If I have offended anybody, it was not intended, but just my frustration at having to repeat myself. I must say that I have been mightily impressed by the lack of abuse that you often get on other forums, which is the reason I rarely visit them anymore. Do like this one though.

Best regards


Chris

Have you ever considered the fact you might be wrong? You say you have studied law for 7 years but that does not make you a tax expert. Why is it the HMRC website says one thing and you say something different yet you give us no reason for this?

benvendetta
3rd November 2013, 08:59 AM
As the HMRC info is online and for all to see, it should be fact. Unless Chris is talking about loopholes, which could be the case given he has declined to offer anymore information:confused:

paullus
3rd November 2013, 09:29 AM
We have not been side tracked.

Really then why the squabbling over who knows what about the legality of grey imports and tax?

My simple point is that I pre-ordered a 12-40 kit on 12th September from the Olympus shop and paid up front in full on 30th September. Now I read about people ordering and receiving theirs within a few days and see discounted offers online. Regardless of the source of these offers I feel it is incredibly frustrating to see while I wait for some indication of when mine will arrive.

Steve

Stu
3rd November 2013, 09:53 AM
Really then why the squabbling over who knows what about the legality of grey imports and tax?

My simple point is that I pre-ordered a 12-40 kit on 12th September from the Olympus shop and paid up front in full on 30th September. Now I read about people ordering and receiving theirs within a few days and see discounted offers online. Regardless of the source of these offers I feel it is incredibly frustrating to see while I wait for some indication of when mine will arrive.

Steve

Yes but these people have not obtained the cameras via UK sourced stock, i.e. it has not come through Olympus UK. Olympus UK are not responsible for this. The discounted offers are either not UK stock or are indicating their UK stock will not be available for 1 to 4 months.

jamsa
3rd November 2013, 10:01 AM
Last week the Amazon UK Price was lower with delivery in days.... The price has since risen again but Park cameras had "free" ie not pre ordered stock last week also....
The issue is the pricing and supply and in a globalised market which should be free and unrestricted and not protected it was still a poor show to find "surplus" stock somewhere and anxious customers here who have paid a lot of money up front not able to have the camera in hand.

crimbo
3rd November 2013, 10:06 AM
...
The issue is the pricing and supply and in a globalised market which should be free and unrestricted and not protected it...

It is
It is an unrestricted free market economy
This is designed to maximise profit
It is not meant to be fair

Stu
3rd November 2013, 10:51 AM
Last week the Amazon UK Price was lower with delivery in days.... The price has since risen again but Park cameras had "free" ie not pre ordered stock last week also....
The issue is the pricing and supply and in a globalised market which should be free and unrestricted and not protected it was still a poor show to find "surplus" stock somewhere and anxious customers here who have paid a lot of money up front not able to have the camera in hand.

Olympus online is just another retailer. When a shipment comes into the country it will be split between all the retailers that have back orders. There will be no special treatment to any one retailer. It is not based on customer orders outstanding but retailer orders outstanding. If special treatment was seen to be given to the Olympus online store then the other retailers would be very and rightfully angry with Olympus UK. Worse case the dealers would drop Olympus product. This has always been the case with any of the major camera brands in the UK.

To get your E-M1 quickly is was never going to be the best idea to order it from a retailer taking lots or orders. Always better to find someone who had a smaller backorder list so you were closer to the top.

Also price control is illegal in the UK. Retailers are free to reduce the prices if they like.

paullus
3rd November 2013, 11:49 AM
Ok thanks to everyone. I think everything that needs to be said has been said. I've expressed my frustration towards the situation. It's out my hands so I'll just let my blood pressure settle down and wait patiently once again for any signs of impending delivery.

On the subject of delivery and on a much happier note I became a Grandfather for the first time earlier this week. Fortunately I had my E5 to capture baby Morgan's first hours in his new World:D


Steve

benvendetta
3rd November 2013, 12:41 PM
Ok thanks to everyone. I think everything that needs to be said has been said. I've expressed my frustration towards the situation. It's out my hands so I'll just let my blood pressure settle down and wait patiently once again for any signs of impending delivery.

On the subject of delivery and on a much happier note I became a Grandfather for the first time earlier this week. Fortunately I had my E5 to capture baby Morgan's first hours in his new World:D


Steve

Congratulations Steve. Hopefully there will be another arrival soon (and for me too).

TonyR
3rd November 2013, 01:18 PM
Olympus online is just another retailer. When a shipment comes into the country it will be split between all the retailers that have back orders. There will be no special treatment to any one retailer. It is not based on customer orders outstanding but retailer orders outstanding. If special treatment was seen to be given to the Olympus online store then the other retailers would be very and rightfully angry with Olympus UK...

I don't necessarily expect the Olympus shop to be delivering in advance of other retailers. I wouldn't mind if the Olympus shop was delivering at the same time as other retailers. But in fact, they are way behind. People have been getting 12-40 kits from other sources for a few days now but we are not expecting it until maybe the week after next from the Olympus shop. And I'll believe that when I see it...

DerekW
3rd November 2013, 01:27 PM
The Olympus shop can do no right.

If they get supplies before the dealers then the dealers will be annoyed and perhaps abandon the brand, if they get supplies after the dealers the direct customers get micturated off. However the individual customers are less important than the main dealers.