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View Full Version : On the point of ditching ...


StephenL
17th October 2013, 01:55 PM
... the taking of raw images. As is my practice with a new camera, I take the first load of shots with raw+jpeg. More so if, like the E-M1, Lightroom's raw converter is only in beta stage.

As it stands, I can't tell the difference between the two once they're imported into Lightroom. The jpegs are just so good. Of course, it could be that when Adobe have finished polishing the raw converter I'll be able to get more out of raw than at present, but for now jpeg seems just as good. I can still import the jpeg files into LR the same way, and process them more-or-less the same, and the originals are still untouched.

But, coupled with the amount of fine tuning you can now do in-camera, I may well stick with jpeg.

Anyone else feel the same way?

birdboy
17th October 2013, 04:09 PM
What I suspect is happening is that LR takes your files applies all the jpg settings (constrast sharpness saturation etc) from the exif info and produces a picture as if it was a jpg produced from the camera, so is it really any surprise that you cannot see any difference. What may make a difference is if you applied exposure corrections to the raw files and then the same to the jpgs. Be interested to know.

StephenL
17th October 2013, 04:13 PM
What I suspect is happening is that LR takes your files applies all the jpg settings (constrast sharpness saturation etc) from the exif info and produces a picture as if it was a jpg produced from the camera, so is it really any surprise that you cannot see any difference. What may make a difference is if you applied exposure corrections to the raw files and then the same to the jpgs. Be interested to know.

That's not what I find with the M5. There, the raw files are flat until processed. LR takes the raw files pure and simple.

birdboy
17th October 2013, 04:37 PM
From what I have read on the subject of raw files the consensus of experts say that there is no such thing and that all so called raw files need some form of tinkering in order to be displayed. It may be that the tinkering that is applied to the EM5 is different to that which is currently applied to the EM1 beta. I do not normally like to get involved in what's happening (because I don't know) and I only offered it as something you may like to consider. Your observation that both files appear the same whereas they do not with the EM5 would is interesting. In what way does the EM5 files appear different?

Ian
17th October 2013, 04:52 PM
At the risk of trying to teach you how to suck eggs - the RAW converter initial view is really just the starting point. I can almost always make improvements and there is much more lee-way than when trying to fettle JPEGs.

Ian

StephenL
17th October 2013, 06:32 PM
At the risk of trying to teach you how to suck eggs - the RAW converter initial view is really just the starting point. I can almost always make improvements and there is much more lee-way than when trying to fettle JPEGs.

Ian

You're right, but I still think the M1 makes a better fist of the jpegs than any previous Oly. I suspect I will notice a difference when A) I try to correct more extreme shots, and/or B) when the Adobe raw converter is finalised.

ian p
17th October 2013, 07:11 PM
If you look at histogram of the E-M5 OOC JPGs you will see the camera has made an automatic decision on where to take the best data. But this is no good in the extreme cases, or where you were unlucky with the exposure. The raw is the only way to get a decent result because you manually decide.

It seems for your cases the automatic decision is fine. If you never ever exceed that, you aren't trying hard enough to take tricky exposures.

theMusicMan
18th October 2013, 10:46 AM
RAW is always better. OK, if you're satisfied with the OOC JPG's when they arrive into LR, then of course that's fine. Job done.

Stephen: Are you applying any develop preset on import of your images from your card/camera into Lightroom? Have you done a side by side comparison of the RAW and JPG using the C command in Lightroom?

Usually, when one imports into Lightroom, the RAW is just that, i.e. a raw file with no settings applied.

@ Birdboy: The only tweaking that takes place is internal to the camera as it has to create a small jpg from the raw image so that this in camera generated jpg can be displayed on the screen of the camera.

StephenL
18th October 2013, 10:50 AM
Stephen: Are you applying any develop preset on import of your images from your card/camera into Lightroom? Have you done a side by side comparison of the RAW and JPG using the C command in Lightroom?



No, never use the develop preset function, and yes, I have compared them side by side. I shall continue using raw, but the ooc jpegs are really good - most of the time. The raw files don't look as washed out, or raw, as from the M5.