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donmcmahan
29th November 2012, 04:16 PM
when Olympus announced the development of a new product that would solve the problem of poor autofocus performance with older SHG 4/3rds lenses on m4/3rds bodies the various forums went nuts with speculation on the "new m4/3rds body that would AF with the older lenses. Personally I quietly thought, "I'll bet its an adapter". today over on PetaPixel I saw this
http://www.petapixel.com/2012/11/28/olympus-apparently-working-on-a-ft-to-mft-adapter-with-built-in-af-and-is/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PetaPixel+%28PetaPixel%29 *yes

Seonnaidh
29th November 2012, 04:20 PM
Logical I suppose.
I guess you are probably right, being from Olympus it will work exceptionally well but I bet it will be very expensive.

andym
29th November 2012, 04:25 PM
It will come with an offer to early adopters of an E-M6/OM2D free.;);););)

DerekC
29th November 2012, 05:14 PM
I was hope for a proper body not a compromise! If it has glass in it now many stops will you loose?

Falk
29th November 2012, 05:15 PM
I'll bet this thing in combination with OM-D body will weight way more then any E-7!? I still fail to get the idea behind m4/3 :confused:

Ulfric M Douglas
29th November 2012, 06:40 PM
From what I imagine, the autofocus will not just rely on the movement of the LENS elements, but movement of the ADAPTER elements too.
Genre-breaking ... is that a thing?
Anyway, very novel.
Now stop faffing about and just bring out the e-720 instead ...

crimbo
29th November 2012, 08:18 PM
thought you could already buy an MMF-2...and a 1 and a 3...

David Morison
29th November 2012, 08:48 PM
So if this possible new adaptor can enable 4/3lens users to photograph fast-moving objects on a m4/3rds camera where does that leave the owners of m4/3rds lenses who can't at the moment photograph fast-moving objects - out in the cold. Come on Olympus we don't want yet another compromise - adapter for this, adapter for that!

David

Rawcoll
29th November 2012, 09:31 PM
Well that's a novel approach. I'd only given thought to either an adapter like Sony use (LA-EA2) for their A-mount lenses being used on the NEX cameras, or an on-sensor phase detection system.

But this thing puzzles me a bit. My take on it is that it will use the camera's contrast AF system to quickly focus the adapter elements rather than use the sluggish phase detect optimised focusing of the 4/3 lenses. But if that is the case, there won't be any of the focus tracking advantages of phase detect AF with this system, because it is still using contrast AF. Also, why on earth is there an image stabilization system incorporated; what's the matter with IBIS?

donmcmahan
29th November 2012, 10:01 PM
" Also, why on earth is there an image stabilization system incorporated; what's the matter with IBIS?"

I was wondering that myself, though I am sure it would be a hit with videographers if it worked on a Panasonic GH1/2/3

Nick Temple-Fry
30th November 2012, 01:33 AM
I was hope for a proper body not a compromise! If it has glass in it now many stops will you loose?

None - or very little

The speed of a lens is based on the entrance aperture and the focal length, neither are altered in this design (unlike in a tele-converter where effectively part of the image is thrown away to narrow the FOV and the remaining light is stretched across the image circle).

I would guess there may be a marginal loss of contrast and perhaps some impact on fine detail resolution as additional glass creates the possibility of more errors/reflections etc. What would concern me more is that this will drive the lens very hard with regard to optical quality, so may well work with 90-250 but be less happy with the 70-300.

Why then the caveat 'very little'; well it will certainly divert a lot less light than a pellicle, that needs enough light taken out of the image stream to drive the focus sensors, but there will be some transmission loss. Will that be signifigant - well I doubt it, after all we don't alter our view of lens speed based on the thickness and number of lens optics.

But if Olympus are serious about this, and after all they do know rather a lot about optics, I'd be keen to see how it worked in practise.

Can't help but wonder if this is just a 'spoiler' patent - put out to keep the pot bubbling though.

Nick

Rawcoll
30th November 2012, 09:22 AM
I am sure it would be a hit with videographers if it worked on a Panasonic GH1/2/3

True, I hadn't thought of that.

RogerMac
30th November 2012, 09:49 AM
Well that's a novel approach. I'd only given thought to either an adapter like Sony use (LA-EA2) for their A-mount lenses being used on the NEX cameras, or an on-sensor phase detection system.

But this thing puzzles me a bit. My take on it is that it will use the camera's contrast AF system to quickly focus the adapter elements rather than use the sluggish phase detect optimised focusing of the 4/3 lenses. But if that is the case, there won't be any of the focus tracking advantages of phase detect AF with this system, because it is still using contrast AF. Also, why on earth is there an image stabilization system incorporated; what's the matter with IBIS?

My take is that here are two components of focussing speed, first the speed of the sensor mechanism and secondly the physical inertia of the lens elements, to get really fast AF systems both need to be addressed. My understanding is that most of the improvement in the OM-D focussing came from a radical re-design of the lenses themselves to reduce the inertia of the moving parts and presumably this is what is being moved into the proposed adaptor. Secondly I think we can assume that on sensor PDAF is likely to come with the next generation of OM-D bodies and it will sort out the moving subjects problem - both for standard mFT lenses and also full FT lenses.

Ulfric M Douglas
30th November 2012, 10:04 AM
I think this particular rumour is a red-herring if we're looking for a solution to 4/3rds lenses on micro bodies.
I expect something different when the day comes.

Rawcoll
30th November 2012, 11:28 AM
Well of course time will tell, but it does have merit which I don't think can be ignored. The main issue with 4/3 lenses on m4/3 bodies is that their focusing systems don't match. 4/3 lenses require a phase detect system, whereas the m4/3 bodies use contrast detect AF. And let's be honest, 4/3 lenses are pretty fast when properly driven, even if their inertia is comparatively high. It's only when there is a focusing system mismatch that everything slows down. So I would argue that if future models of m4/3 cameras had on-board phase detect, then there would be no need for an optical adaptor; just feed the focusing signals direct to the lens. Otherwise, continue to use contrast detect and feed that signal to the adaptor, which is optimised for contrast detect, and leave the 4/3 lens focusing alone. I am sure there is a lot more to this though; it could be that there will be on-board phase detection and that it is a lot easier to focus a single secondary lens set than try to cater for the whole plethora of 4/3 lenses that could be attached to it.

But as Don said, if Oly are keen to make this a universal m4/3 adaptor and they wanted to incorporate image stabilisaton, they'd need to use a lens group within the adaptor to do it.

Who knows, but then it's fun to speculate. :)

Rawcoll
30th November 2012, 11:42 AM
So if this possible new adaptor can enable 4/3lens users to photograph fast-moving objects on a m4/3rds camera where does that leave the owners of m4/3rds lenses who can't at the moment photograph fast-moving objects - out in the cold.


Indeed so! All the existing m4/3 lenses are designed for contrast AF, and I don't know if they could be made to work satisfactorily in a phase detect system. Nikon's new mirrorless camera does have on-board phase detect AF, but then it's lenses have been designed for that in the first place.

Nova Invicta
4th December 2012, 05:25 PM
The design will not alter the f stop and I agree with Nick Temple Fry that additional lens elements can effect contrast, sharpness, CA etc but if designed from low dispersion glass and its Nyquist is matched more closely to the pixel pitch of the cameras then it could actually be a very good otimised adapter. Olympus digital lenses unlike Canon & Nikon for instance were all designed for digital and keeping light as parrallel as possible which is important when light is falling on microlenses on the photosites. Equally if its stablised then many shots that would anyway have been soft because of the wrong shutter speed or ISO will be sharp the down side is likely to be cost & weight.