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Wreckdiver
3rd December 2010, 11:07 PM
Having had my E-3 for 3 years I haven't really bothered with the camera's pop-up flash, until now.

I was using the pop-up flash to trigger an FL-50R in slave mode (not RC mode). Setting the cameras flash to the single lightning bolt and power setting from 1/1 (full) to 1/64 and the Flash in Manual Slave mode.

The camera emits a pre-flash which is triggering the FL-50R prematurely. Looking through the E-3's manual doesn't give much info. I thought this Flash mode was manual but the pre-flash suggests TTL mode.

Any ideas?

Thanks

Steve

photo_owl
3rd December 2010, 11:53 PM
the camera is only going to emit any sort of pre-flash if it's in one of the TTL auto modes or the camera is set to RC mode...

this latter is probably the most likely as you would know about the other - the camera body doesn't know that you have set the FL unit to M; if it's set to RC mode in menu I belive that how it operates (and to my mind it's a weakness not to have this menu item on the flash info screen as a switch).

but then again I haven't double checked this as I am in a hurry! Will certainly try and duplicate in the morning if I am wrong.

Wreckdiver
3rd December 2010, 11:59 PM
the camera is only going to emit any sort of pre-flash if it's in one of the TTL auto modes or the camera is set to RC mode...

this latter is probably the most likely as you would know about the other - the camera body doesn't know that you have set the FL unit to M; if it's set to RC mode in menu I belive that how it operates (and to my mind it's a weakness not to have this menu item on the flash info screen as a switch).

but then again I haven't double checked this as I am in a hurry! Will certainly try and duplicate in the morning if I am wrong.

The camera has RC mode turned off.

Tried the same with my E-30 and that's working perfectly, no pre-flash.

Edit: Just noticed that the camera's flash emits a "pre-flash" on every flash setting, including OFF. This would suggest to me that it's the RC system but it's turned off :confused:

Steve

Ross the fiddler
4th December 2010, 12:29 AM
The camera has RC mode turned off.

Tried the same with my E-30 and that's working perfectly, no pre-flash.

Edit: Just noticed that the camera's flash emits a "pre-flash" on every flash setting, including OFF. This would suggest to me that it's the RC system but it's turned off :confused:

Steve

You would also need to turn off focus assist & just use the popup flash in manual set to low, if you are wanting it for trigger only or at the desired manual setting for front fill to have total control over the flash amount. Of course, the FL50R needs to be set to manual in slave mode too, otherwise an unknown amount of light will occur with any moving of your subject.

Wreckdiver
4th December 2010, 12:47 AM
Cheers Ross, sussed it.

It was the focus assist (AF Illuminat). Turned it off and all is fine.

As I say, I never use the internal flash so it never gets raised and therefore never used the focus assist. If I am shooting in dark conditions there has always been an FL50(R) fitted.

Thanks for your help *chr

Steve

Graham_of_Rainham
4th December 2010, 03:39 PM
Steve,

Now you have it working, try putting the flash in Slave Auto, close to the subject and with the E-3 in Manual mode at 125 f/8 and the popup set to 1/64 and shoot from a distance.

I'm always playing with the flash to get different effects and this is one of my favorite techniques (at the moment)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21646256@N08/5196842854/

Please show us your results

Wreckdiver
4th December 2010, 05:39 PM
A quick test shot using the settings you mention Graham. As shot by the camera with no adjustments at all:

Flash = Auto
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/713/Manual-auto.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29033)



and some more using the FL-50R in manual mode at different power settings:


Flash = 1/8 power
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/713/Manual-1_8.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29032)


Flash = 1/4 power
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/713/Manual-1_4.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29029)


Flash = 1/2 power
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/713/Manual-1_2.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29028)


Flash = Full power (1/1)
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/713/Manual-1_1.jpg (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29027)

I am much more comfortable using the flash in manual mode though; I have total control and can get the results I want. The FL-50R fired very reliably with the camera's internal flash at 1/64 power (approx 2m distance). However, it is directional and also in RC mode. I would like to play around using the flash behind the subject to get a halo effect but not using the any trigger flash. RC mode would probably not work either as the flash would be out of sight, so I am thinking of getting something like the Four Channel PT-04 Wireless Flash Trigger


Remote flash opens up a huge world of possibilities and some fanatstic effects.

Steve

shenstone
4th December 2010, 06:02 PM
These triggers are definitely the way to go as I've said in a couple of threads recently I really like my new ones (Cactus v2's)

I think that a lot of people thought that Olympus "R" flashguns are radio controlled, but as you have determined they are light controlled which means you always have some front lighting so I think these radio channel transmitter/receivers are much better

Regards
Andy

Wreckdiver
4th December 2010, 06:41 PM
The RC system is definitely a light and not a radio system. Pity that because it would be a superb system otherwise. I have just been playing with my E-3 and an FL50(R) and no way could I get the flash to fire in RC mode unless there was a clear line of sight between the camera and flash or the flash could see bounced light from the camera's internal flash.

Note (for those not familair with the RC mode): the camera can control a flash (or flashes) via the RC mode or in a master/slave mode. Both are controlled by the cameras internal pop-up flash but the RC mode contains transmitted channel and power setting data (1-4 channels and 1-3 groups with power and flash mode etc.) encoded within the light emmitted. In a master/slave configuration the slaves just respond to the light emitted by the camera's top flash and use the settings set on the flash. Think I've got that right :)

There are several of these cheap wireless systems and when compared with ones like the Pocket Wizard they seem extremely good value for money.

Steve

Graham_of_Rainham
4th December 2010, 08:29 PM
Wow, you have been busy :)

I previously used manual slave mode, as this is what I was used to from the old days, and would even adjust levels by moving the lights in and out as well. :o Now I find it easier to use the Auto SL mode and simply alter the light ratios for each of the guns by dialing in the f/stops that the gun will fire for.

The advantage being that when the subject moves about or alters reflectivity, the guns automatically adjusts the light power to compensate and the exposure remains the same.

With both guns set at f/8
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/EPL4695.JPG (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29038)


With on at f/8 and the other at f/5.6
http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/data/500/EPL4696.JPG (http://e-group.uk.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/29039)

I'm starting to use the full RC mode more and more as adjusting the guns from the camera saves me getting up and down (especially to the overhead light) - As I get older I welcome anything that saves me effort :D

Ross the fiddler
5th December 2010, 01:12 AM
It's also nice if you have an FL36R with a snoot pointing down above the head (to one side) to give a little highlight in the hair.

Graham_of_Rainham
5th December 2010, 11:58 AM
It's also nice if you have an FL36R with a snoot pointing down above the head (to one side) to give a little highlight in the hair.

Absolutly agree. These shots, however were "thrown-up" just to show the shadows and the effect of the changes in lighting ratios.

I use this block head quite a bit for working out my lighting before I use a live subject.
Plus, it don't move, moan and want to be paid... ;)

*chr